The FL4K OFF-Meta

With the reveal of the final (for now) level cap being 65, it’s safe to say that the “meta” FL4K build will land on TPI, Megavor, and Frenzy. Of course other specs will be possible, but that will more than likely be the undisputed best when the time comes.

SO, how about we look at some of the potential for those other specs instead of dwelling on the meta? I’ve already stated earlier that this is the best cap for pets, since we can get every pet damage skill we need. However, by shifting our points around slightly, we can also unlock every pet and almost every action skill augment for the most diversity possible.

I can’t imagine running a green/blue build now, but what the heck let’s toss something together anyway.

It doesn’t look great, but eh.

Lastly, could always try going all in with the red tree

So, what weird ■■■■ can you think of? Doesn’t need to actually work yet, but we can at least try to get the imagination juices flowing.


I feel like this would be best Gamma Burst build.

Level 65 URad, FA Fl4k here, but…

What is considered “Off-Meta”? All involve roughly the same skills…and Dominance still sucks hot a**, so no one’s picking that one. If most Fl4k builds can kill fast, is there a such thing as “meta” when it comes to Fl4k?

I guess the thing that’s different here, is I chose Hive Mind, Barbaric Yawp, and Shared Spirit. Not having a health gate and all, HM & SS might make a difference, but idk. BY will be cool tho…better than Hidden Machine, which is inconsistent.

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@WxndaBread This is pretty much identical to the build I am using right now, and actually this is the same way I thought I would finish out the build. I use a Transformer and Deathless.

And yes, Shared Spirit most definitely makes a big difference on the build, even rocking a Deathless. I have tried it with and without Shared Spirit, and it just doesn’t work without it. I am starting to think that Hive Mind might not help that much with damage sharing, given that you’re already sharing 50% due to SS. So maybe you could get rid of that and put some more points into Ferocity, He Bites, or GFTE. I always drop a point into GFTE, as I have found it does make a difference now that the pet is doing real damage.

I forgot to mention I also use only 1 point in HC as well. I am not quite sure about my level 65 build (again, running a Transformer, Deathless, and Urad gear). Maybe this?

Guess it would help if I read the post, y’all ain’t ready for Negavore.

Three shot Fade Away with Not My Circus and Until You Are Dead. You would rely on actually hitting crits for fast cycling and with Splash 200 weapons could still get some solid AC damage. The build would be pretty damn tanky and I really think could be made work with no Capstones.

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I think one of the first big brain moments I had for BL3 was going capstone-less for a pet build back in October-ish. Cool to see it brought up again.

This is a weird explanation, but basically you know it when you see it. Some things like Blue/Green builds are just obviously off-meta. However, a build that takes TPI but not Megavor would also be pretty clearly off-meta.

I think as a general rule of thumb, FL4K meta consists of

  1. Full investment in IPS, LNT, Big Game, MDG, Galactic Shadow, and Megavor for red tree. Fill in the rest however.
  2. Green tree should have Furious attack, Lick the Wounds, Turn Tail, and TPI. URad complicates things so fill in the rest as needed.
  3. For Blue tree, I’d say “excessive” pet investment (more than 5 points invested in tier 1 skills, Atomic Aroma augment, etc…), Hive Mind, and Dominance are pretty off-meta.

EDIT to remove my own comment because I haven’t used it in so long, I forgot that FAF only works when you are above half health. I thought it worked like TPI and just got smaller when under half health.

The lesson as always: I’m an idiot. And have been playing too much Moze lately.

How good is SS without Deathless and only half health? What is considered “low health”? I’d rather have the Pearl instead of that artifact…

And I don’t like investing in Pet…I kill way faster than it ever could.

I believe it’s 33%, same as Release the Beast for Krieg. As soon as you see the little red exclamation point appear on your health bar it should be active.

I have dabbled in the forbidden art of no Capstones. I didn’t really feel a difference in damage, but sorely missed Megavore/Leave No Trace ammo return.

Yeah, it’s the utility you end up missing the most.

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So SS is bad for half-health URad then…if my shield does go, then I’m probably gonna die anyway

For one point you may as well, but it is much better with Deathless imo.

I’d end up sacrificing damage without the Pearl…if I’m going to be a glass cannon, I guess I’ll emphasize that CANNON part.

I don’t agree with that. I have tried it both ways - Front Loader and Pearl (or whatever relic you want) and Transformer and Deathless - and I find the Transformer/Deathless to be much more survivable. The survival on the Transformer is just that much better IMO. I also kill things way faster than I ever did with the Rakk build and multiple projectiles.

EDIT: I’m gonna edit again because I can’t read good tonight, clearly. I would agree with @boombumr that SS only costs you a point, and you will definitely be below the 33% often with a Front Loader build. Sorry guys, my brain clearly is not working well this evening LOL

Having a Urad build I use quite a bit, I agree that a Transformer/Deathless is definitely great survivability. However you do lose out on quite a bit of damage not using the pearl and putting enough points into the Master tree for Shared Spirit.

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@tysonyar gets solid use of SS on his build with Transformer/Deathless.

I preferred grabbing 5/5 in Hidden Machine with Red Fang as it felt more potent to me. Survivability does take a hit though

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That is what I use. Having used both options in GTD, using Hidden Machine and the Pearl makes quite a difference in damage.

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Only thing I am slightly excited about is being able to go Green/Blue while being able to get the Scorcher and, depending on finessing ability, maybe even the Countess.

That in theory would benefit Rakk Builds or Gamma Builds (yes, I like Gamma w/ Spiderant).

Then to a lesser extent I could probably make a decent Nurse Fl4k. Not like my team makes smart use of my generous Health Regen sharing. They just get more reckless. lol

But yeah, to me the 5 levels don’t change much. Maybe there’s something I’m not thinking of yet tho.

That elemental bonus from Scorcher is top notch for any build lol