The Flak over Fl4k and what it cost

Exactly. Again. Or some create a male they’d like irl. Don’t think people would think this way with FL4K unfortunately even with the given heads lmao I mean I could be wrong lmao :rofl:
And it cant even be related back to real dolls, those were made with a purpose behind them/an intention to have sex with it or for some form a bond with an inanimate object pretending its talking back to you that’s now mental illness.

TBF, do you also see how mean people are to them when they politely correct someone?

I hate to keep saying this, because outside of Fl4k drama Reddit is still a pretty chill community for BL3, but go over there and see how the discussion goes after someone posts “FL4K goes by they/them. They’re non-binary”. That is all it takes to spark a war in the comments. And that is far from yelling.

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Anyone reading anything that doesn’t have tone of voice can say anything sounds a certain way. If Someone on the opposite side of this debacle wrote those same exact words as you just did, people see it as malicious when it’s only being questioned why and now causes the conversation of speculation of their origins. But, by your words, when you say this it will incite a riot. Some will say this sounds like war propaganda.

The real life argument vs the borderlands universe argument is getting too meshed together. To have fl4k be they/them, is in terms, correct; because it’s a robot; not a human male or human female. People get confused about the real life argument because when a human being says they’re neither gender that makes you you, it’s hard to grasp because what else are you besides a human male, female or feel a little bit of both? What’s the other options that fall under they ? This is how most keep it simple minded people think to not let things out of control and too complicated

Non-binary folks existing is equivalent to a religious belief?

I’m male and heterosexual.

Would anyone care to suggest that that is a statement of belief?

Apparently Queen Victoria didn’t think that lesbians existed. The attitude of denying non-binary folks exist is probably as valid.

But human sexuality is complicated. That’s why we’re having this discussion.

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As soon as someone compares a topic to religion tends to end with people mad. It’s comparing apples and oranges.

I still stand by my post yesterday.

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I know I’m saying the reason behind peoples arguments is that complicated things confuse people when shown an image and asked what do you see like this is a Rorschach Blot Test which in then there is no wrong or right answer, just a matter of perception.

I think the closest thing to this kind of discussion we ever had in our gaming group was when I told our DM my character worshipped hermaphrodite. (pronounced in a way to sound like Aphrodite). At which point he calmly stood up, walked over to the nearest doorway, then slammed his forehead into the inside of the doorframe a few times. Given how often we get him to do that, its surprising he hasn’t suffered brain damage yet.

On another note about FL4K when I read the whole thing originally about being an AI and the whole pronoun referencing as they/them. My thoughts when about it went to thinking this was possibly due to being an AI created by the merging of multiple smaller AI. In which case being referred to as they/them would be more appropriate if they still identified as the sum of all their parts rather than 1 being.

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I know that. I’m saying that the reason behind peoples argument or thought pattern is that they can be come easily confused when simple things become complicated like a Rorschach Test that you’re asked what do you see and get quizzed on it when there is no wrong or right answer, it’s a matter of perception. When people feel like their forced to do something against their will that doesn’t match what they see or hear that’s when you start to get mania, from all sides. It’s an RPG, the players are what each character is at the end of the day, if you’re a male you’ll see yourself as the male character as you would like to see yourself irl Bc you in real life aren’t like this or a girl character that might mimic a girl you fancy in real life or if you’re a girl player a character you’d like to wish you were more like. BUT it has more negative connotations if you’re a girl and relate to certain character models due to being “slutty” so you pick the boy or the one that isn’t human to avoid this. If you’re picking FL4K in this sense then you see yourself as an inanimate object come to life, locked and loaded ready to kill anything that gets in your way? See where people are having a hard time seeing the parallel in relating to this character and that NB is a coding joke that they might of thought “oh ■■■■ we might have to say they’re NB now because people will get the joke and get mad that it’s not actual representation so we’ll add the flag colors on the pin so no one gets mad” :woman_shrugging:t2:

Idk why but all this sillyness reminded me of a game I used to play. In the game, you had to opportunity to unlock a new hero, Damian Hellstrom. If you are familiar with Marvel Comics, well you know who he was. Certain missions required him to progress and make it towards the end. But people just refused to get him simply because of the way he looks (big pentagram on his chest) and then of course his dad. But it seemed like a silly reason to protest the game and refuse to continue.

This is exactly what I originally said. Multiple components of different robots to create 1. Or my CL4P theory, multiple components of that line to preserve the line -just in case- and FL4K is a super CL4P! :hugs:

That mindset sucks! (Who doesn’t want to be Damion! His look is awesome!)I always go for the obscure out of the ordinary characters / stories. Maybe I’m just too edgy for my own good.

I myself love love love female characters anyway they look even if it’s deemed too sexual, so what? It shows they’re not ashamed of who they are. But also makes me hesitant to play as any in fear of the misrepresentation because of given character and being a female myself. Why is it only acceptable for guys to like these characters and flaunt them, but if a girl does you must be this or that. Why? Then we’re ashamed and made to despise female characters and see them as an unobtainable goal that we’d never relate to Bc we don’t look like them. (Like celebrities) Maya is one of my first MAIN girl character that I’ve ever mained for YEARS and keep going back to and still play everyday. Ive always been drawn to the Male characters because what theyre about and how they portray themselves vs how they look for their big chests out. Maya is the one of only characters that is not over exposed or hyper sexual like example Moxxi, I love Moxxi she is my favorite, but if I say that I must be like her, no? People want some substance and some sort of originality to their character. More people would rather play the unknown option zer0 making the mystery more fun for you as the player to speculate & create fanfic then playing as the generic looking Axton or the not so appealing Sal, that’s why they added in Krieg; another cool ass looking mystery character. (krieg is my 2nd main because he’s the best character ever) #pleasebringkriegback

its because scientifically non-binary isn’t a thing, it has no basis scientifically so it is an ideology. i was curious on its basis so was researching it earlier. hey atleast im attempting to understand its origin and its basis, however that is what my findings were.
now being male and female is proven because we do in fact have genitalia
i understand the belief in that you feel like something else, not being insulting these are the words i found when looking into it but from what i gathered thats the extent of it.
if you look at it from an outsider’s view though its illogical so that does make it a tough ideology to understand without logic all you have is your own belief. this is what makes it similar to a religion.

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Also adds to my point that people want to also be able to, for some strange reason, connect / see these characters in a fantasy (sexual) way maybe some people are mad that they cannot see FL4K this way since there’s no bobs or pp on this robot (to our knowledge) and want to really see them doing dirty things! :thinking:

Uh, any links or evidence for that buddy? 'Cause I just did a cursory search of my library website and found a tonne of articles in medical science journals discussing the experience of non-binary people and their healthcare needs.

Summary

https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s11930-017-0111-8

https://doi.org/10.1080/15532739.2018.1426074

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6209926/

https://doi.org/10.1111/nin.12150

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Thank you for your contribution. There are quite some links posted above regarding the scientific side of the discussion. I would politely advise to read up on the matter before posting again.

@cswilliams93 I neither feel the need to change that nor do I have any interest to. But I suggest reading this:

This is no discussion about gender, that was clarified by Gearbox and especially the creator of Fl4k sufficiently.

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I think we’re at a point in internet culture where we can articulate what we mean rather clearly, even through text.

For instance, IF I TYPE LIKE THIS, WHAT WOULD YOU THINK MY TONE IS!!!

This is a common (and incredibly unsubtle) way of displaying tone on the internet. There are many others, some of which have been seen in this thread. Speech on the internet is incredibly informal, and thanks to all these emojis, caps, bolds, etc… we have dozens of ways to convey tone that you can’t use in, say, an academic paper or professional writing. When people want to get their point across, even through the internet, they have ways to do that can be snarky and obnoxious. However, there are also plenty of times when the words are just what they are.

When you have the sentence “FL4K is they/them. They’re non-binary”, what is the difference between taking it at face value and reading into it? What else is there that can be said in that sentence other than what is there? I suppose I don’t see how, outside of some other context, that sentence in of itself can be seen as aggressive.

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Doesn’t matter. Rule 34 and Bowsette exist, along with Sonic fanfics * shudders *.