The Flak over Fl4k and what it cost

Who even said that? What I’m saying is you’re blatantly resorting to a common argumentative fallacy, trying to invalidate an issue by bringing up another completely unrelated issue.

Like I said, look up “relative privation fallacy”.

What a shocker.

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Anyone in existence that demands illogical obedience.

People make snap judgements because we’re trained to to identify people.
I work in an age restricted store and when people under 18 come, at first glance assessment needs to be made if you aren’t given the opportunity to see proof you have to make an assumption based off what you see to make sure if you’re right or wrong in the situation. Just because a kid is over a foot taller than me doesn’t mean that’s an adult that just means I’m short. If you have braces and a prepubescent face my guess is that you’re not 18 yet.
This is why people base what they see and hear to experience and what they know.
People that have a bit of a sense of humor to them and are fans of ProZD will relate this character to sungwon because they recognize the voice and know who’s speaking. It’s not wrong if it’s something you don’t chose to also do, then don’t.
No one is telling you to not call this character anything but male pronouns in response to this, they’re saying you can’t force a dialogue on people they don’t agree with just because feelings might get hurt if the see a word referencing men.

And I never dismissed anything I’m drawing comparisons with different scenarios.

And I quote you:

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Nothing fantastical about asking everyone to adhere to house rules. Ever been to an amusement park? “Line cutters will be ejected from the park” sound familiar?

I’m not pushy, I’m pointing out that this is someone else’s house and you should wipe your feet before entering. It’s pretty simple. You can’t order a bacon cheeseburger at a kosher deli. House rules. Gearbox, no individual you are conversing with, asked you to follow their rules on their website. If you dont get that I’m sorry, but it’s a pretty cut and dry point you really can’t argue against. They are not telling you what to do elsewhere, just requesting you do something specific here. It’s not as complex as everything that’s been said upthread. As for snarky, I’m really not trying to be. Mayhap I’m not the sensitive one here?

Which is fine, so long as everyone follows the rules of the homeowner. A lot of people don’t see things the same as me. Doesn’t make them or me wrong. Just means there is the possibility of a stimulating discussion.

Let’s not attack California. There’s no reason, and the problems you reference are not unique to that state. I’d maintain that this is only a BS issue if you’ve not been on the unpleasant end of it for the entirety of your life.

Please, listen to the cat even if you won’t listen to me.

Also, @monsterrblood. You can reply to more than one individual in a post. You could post one long post rather than double, triple, and quadruple posting.

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In regards to what that person said about California…

You’re taking it out of context.

*sigh *

Here you go:

Fallacy of relative privation (also known as “appeal to worse problems” or “not as bad as”) – dismissing an argument or complaint due to the existence of more important problems in the world, regardless of whether those problems bear relevance to the initial argument. “First World problems” are a subset of this fallacy.

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Exactly. The point I’m trying to make.
You can tell someone any thing you want but when it contradicts their own beliefs and you tell them all they’ve known is a lie, you will get this; people freaking out and unwilling to listen and understand because the way it’s conveyed isn’t ideal.
Because youre telling people to believe in something with no proof as to why they should.
And when they don’t immediately follow orders punishment will ensue, like how people view the police doing their job as police brutality.
When in essence everything being told to you can be and is a lie, so inherently you can’t believe everything you hear & see.
If I told you aliens existed and you asked me for proof and I said I don’t have any but just take my word for it, it makes it hard to believe me when I don’t have the capability to prove I’m right, so you’ll question my thought process, personally disagree, but let me think im right in order to not offend me.
Another comparison, not dismissal.

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Which part of ‘Flak identifies as non-binary’ do you not believe?

And I see the ‘flak is just a character! Why do I have to care about their feelings?’ point being made again.

Everyone:

It’s not (nor has it ever been) about hurting a fictional character’s feelings. If that were the case, then I’d understand the surprise.

It’s just about keeping this forum inclusive. Read the forum rules. (Really, though, this time, read them. I know the vast majority of you still haven’t) ‘Be polite and don’t be a jerk’ is all that we’re asking here.

If that’s too much to bear, too much of an affront to your deeply held beliefs, other online spaces exist that will cater to your needs, where you might feel, I dunno, safer?

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The amount of effort I’m gonna have to put in to stay on topic, catch as many threads as I can, and clear some junk up here is gonna be monumental. Hahahah.

Medical Science and Gender. This is for a conversation had between Hattie, @monsterrblood, and @josh12452.

There’s some things you should know. And because Intersex people don’t want to be used as the “Gotcha Card” in gender debates. I’m actually not gonna invoke them. Gender and Sex are both thing’s we’ve created to explain things. Make no doubt, there is no divine source of knowledge. Any thing we “know” is stuff we made up and have decided works.

Multiple cultures have had more than two genders. That was their understanding of their peoples and how they related to one another. Even western culture has had, technically, multiple genders. We just love simplicity, even if it obfuscates the truth. So we’ve diluted everything down to a binary. Which is bad.

And here’s why: when you say everyone is either “this” or “that”, you have a very small understanding of intricate reactions. Especially in medicine. There are actually multiple chromosomal compositions that make “men” or “women” as we use, but aren’t just XX or XY.

Now, what makes someone fit into our two boxes, that we’ve labeled man and woman, are a bunch of features that are affected by those sex chromosomes, and other genetic factors. Hormone levels are a big one. Brain chemistry. These things create what we call “primary and secondary sex characteristics”. These include breasts, genitals, hair growth, vocal cord formation, bone structure, and many other things.

We as humans use these things to “clock” other humans for what we believe they are. And if news stories are any indication, with bathroom laws and people trying to police them, it turns out a not zero number of Cis Women don’t “pass” for “women”. This is where I could branch off into how trans regulation is just another way to force cis women to adhere to patriarchal beauty standards or hide at home, but I promised to stay on topic.

Now. I mentioned earlier in the thread that I once read that there was a test study on some medication that returned a scattered set of results. Separating into “men” and “women” yielded no valuable common data. However, when they broke those groups down, group men a would have a shared experience, group men b would have a shared experience, group women a would have a shared experience, and group women b would have a shared experience.

This would seem to suggest that there is a categorization method to better use to separate individuals into like groups. These different groups probably had different chemical compositions compared to the other groups, but shared chemical compositions within their group. We could take from this that these are actually separate genders or sexes, we just decide to glaze over them because we like having our two nice little boxes.

But the thing about medicine, testing, what have you, is that we want to narrow things down as best we can. If we can determine that chemo will always work for Men subsection a, but will kill non-binary subsection g, then we can make sure to use proper treatment programs if we can find the groups to which people belong. But as long as we keep forcing people into these two boxes, we’re gonna have trouble, because we’re cutting ourselves off from the full spectrum.

We keep trying to describe the rainbow of people using only the tool kit of a monochrome world.

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nah… that MODs here are all right man. i think you’re going overboard with your disagreement. You give a hint of that at the start of your post mentioning you can’t express yourself fully in many areas of your life. I suggest you work on fixing that part of your life rather than worry about the tiny details of how a video game forum is MODded.

Like you …I disagree with this pronoun stipulation stuff… but you are going way too far dawg.

Generally speaking, the MODeration here is solid. One detail I disagree with doesn’t change that.

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Absolutely aware this is another post. I can’t bring myself to either a, accidentally delete half way through. Or b, have a massive wall of text.

@monsterrblood. One of the first things you said upon entering this conversation is that it was silly and “all sides” are being a bit much. The reason that’s wrong is that one side is asking “hey, let us exist and be who we are” and the other is very much “I don’t think you exist, or, I think you’re mentally broken”. Which may not sound like an awful thing to say, but calling someone broken means you think they should be fixed…or eliminated. The very first start to eugenics (the belief in cleansing the gene pool) is to think something is a bad trait that shouldn’t exist.

We’d be a lot farther in trans study if a certain set of Dictators and Powerful Jerks hadn’t done everything they could to burn the research, burn the history, burn the existence of trans people out of their naratives. And you may not want to do that. But the language you use points in that direction, and I need you to recognize that.

A lot of people like to come here and toss the word Fascism around, especially when it comes to the queer community and our desire to exist and see ourselves and not be afraid. The problem is, Fascism requires the Power Of The State. We are a small fraction (but remember, a small fraction of a massive number is still a massive number) of people asking for people to not be massive jerks to us for existing. To not make laws that prevent us from living normal lives where we weren’t hurting anyone.

You keep coming here and ignoring a very big point. We WERE TOLD by THE LEAD WRITER that a NON-BINARY PERSON was on this writing team and that they helped male Fl4k. That Fl4k was part of their dream. So EVERY TIME you come here and tell us “That’s not what it is” you are being untrue and insincere. You could have said “cool, they” and let it go. But you keep needing to justify your use of “they” in a way that invalidates us, and undermines what the LEAD WRITER told us.

How is this different from religious beliefs? Well, as I pointed out above, there’s science to back up that our understanding of sex and gender is limited, and that we’re working on it. We have people who know for sure they aren’t in those boxes. Religious beliefs are standards of acting and behaving based on the belief in a higher power that directs you to behave a certain way. We’re asking that you don’t discount our lived in experiences as we have most DEFINITELY thought more about our gender than you’ve thought about almost anything. And I mean you as in everyone. No one has thought about anything as much as a non-binary person has thought about their gender.

More later.

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https://lawshelf.com/videos/entry/freedom-of-speech-exceptions-categories-of-speech-not-protected

Incitement, “fighting words”, obscenity, defamation, commercial speech, “cases in which freedom of speech is weighed against a more compelling interest”

Those are the limitations to the first amendment and the “other compelling interest” refers to national security and giving a person due process(a fair trial)

…and this forum is only subject to any rules as decided by Gearbox.

Did I need to say that? I’m not sure. But just in case anyone thought that the first amendment applies here, it doesn’t, as that relates to freedom of the media to criticise the American government. Which is a thing I strongly support.

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Please don’t misgender me, thanks.

How is finding a place online, wherever it may be, to be able to talk about things you don’t normally get a chance to in real life due to whatever circumstances, like being stifled, constitute as going over board? What?

When my comparison is that people dealing with these issues on the other side of this also feels stifled all the time because they’re misunderstood?

If they weren’t there wouldn’t be this argument about it from either side fighting for what’s right and wrong. Everyone would be neutral. But when ideas that are not your own are forced upon you, people will need a bit of convincing to not fight against them.

Both sides are wrong and right in hindsight.
The way the state of the world is, sadly, people are not all going to bend the knee, when you have a society built on fighting for your own individual rights.

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Back when I was a mod for a Disney forum, that was the typical reponse people gave when they went against the community rules and ToS.

But they hardly read it. Just skipped it just to post junk.

But back to the matter at hand, pretty much got called names because I was simply pointing out the id of FL4K on an Instagram post. Received hate except for a few people (one being the original artist and the others who I believe also id themselves like FL4K).

I’ll be the one enjoying a game for the sake of having fun. I’ll let thosr who literally want to protest the game and not play it enjoy the misery. It’s there loss for something dumb on their part.

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It’s a slippery slope PH! You ask for a pronoun use now, and the next thing you know they’ll be raiding my house in the dead of night to steal Lady Chatterley’s Lover!

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He used an American state as an example and asked the question.

Lol thank you ThreadMaster.
Again I’m on a phone, I don’t have the luxury to be on a computer. sooorrryyyyy

And the day I listen to a cat, I beg you, please call the Authorities on my behalf.

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