The Good, the Bad and the Ugly

Hi,

I’m a long time Borderlands player, and I’m also a game developer (Designer) so have some insight into how and why decisions are made.
Been waiting for BL3 like everyone else, with baited breath and have played it non-stop since release. Well, up until a week ago when I realised I didn’t want to boot it up at the moment.
Then the Halloween event dropped and I played through it once and then sat looking at the screen wondering if I should just rinse and repeat what I’d done or if I log out. I logged out.

So, I LOVE the core of the game. Have no problem with the story. There’s some great additions to QoL such as the teleporting to waypoints instead of just the Fast Travel stations, and the auto buy ammo etc. We all know the good.

IMO the bad things, aside from console performance and awful ‘lag’ on the menus etc are things that will get better I’m sure.
However, the criminal lack of bank space is something almost game-breaking.
It’s about the loot right? Yes, we don’t all have to collect every variation of every legendary but the option should be there to do so seeing as the pursuit of ever-better guns is the core of the game.

50 bank spaces is completely inadequate for that and has made me not want to play. I’m still on the hunt for an Anointed Night Hawkin, and a better Legendary CMOD and if I find ‘upgrades’ to already collected guns then I will throw the old version out, but quite often I find another version of a gun that is comparable to one I already have except it is Fire damage rather than Electric or vice versa, meaning I want to keep both. This obviously leads to the familiar mini-game of going to the (full) bank and (full) inventory and literally having to decide which awesome thing I want to discard over another awesome thing.

Spending 30 mins+ every time I find a gun trying to decide which legendary to drop is not fun. Sometimes it’s literally impossible due to there not being a ‘worse’ item, just that it’s different, meaning I don’t want to throw any of them.
It stops me playing because I’m leaving items I would otherwise loot on the floor.

Then we get the Halloween event with a ton of new Anointments on the weapons and now even some purple items are getting on par or above my prized legendaries. Kinda cool on the surface, making me question my loadout and use epics instead of legendaries, except for the point that I have no room for these 5+ new items that are definitely useful at the moment without sacrificing other ones. Which is bad enough, but I’m unaware if the terror mechanic will persist beyond the 5th December. Will these become more or less useless at that point?

It all adds up to discouraging what I would normally be doing, which is just enjoying running around with a very small chance of getting an upgrade.
I’ve never had these feelings in any similar loot-based game such as Diablo. Don’t get me wrong, those games had storage issues at times but only very rarely would it get to the point that BL3 is at constantly.

I’m not bothered about the nerfs, as I don’t play a build that everyone else does anyway. Even when I know that build is miles better than the one I’ve made.
I don’t care about the majority of the loot pool being world drops, in fact I’m pretty p****d off that they have bowed to the pressure and are going to put certain items onto certain bosses so they can be more consistently farmed. Why?
Unfortunately people want to play the game to ‘win’, to have the best at any cost and they want to know they go to Boss A to get Item Z. That’s not what I personally want as it just discourages playing 95% of the other content?!
Also, I’d like to see Legendaries actually be a lot rarer than they are. People don’t know or don’t care that unwittingly they are ruining the longevity of a game they love by wanting legendaries to drop every ten seconds. Yes, we all play to get them but they should feel special. They are Legendary. When you are getting 3+ legendaries popping out of a single kill on occasion and leaving 99% of them on the floor as they are the 50th version of that you have seen…it loses something,

I mean, it’s too late to change any of that stuff now, but I’m always surprised how impatient people are and how willing developers are to make a core game mechanic into a farce, to appease people. Of course I get it, and I’m the minority here so why would they tailor it to me rather than the millions who think differently?
Most people want legendaries popping every 5 seconds, while for me I like the thrill of the hunt. I want to not see one for a while and then get that little adrenaline rush when one pops out of a corpse!
When was the last time you got that feeling playing BL3?

Anyway, this sounds negative but for me its just pointing out my personal feelings towards the game at the moment. I still think it’s a great game and I will definitely be back playing once the bank upgrades come online, and when I know if the Halloween event items are void or not.
If you’re enjoying the game regardless of all this then I envy you, cos I envisaged myself playing this game constantly for a long, long time. Not breaking off for a couple of months only a month or so after release :frowning:

Cheers,
Daz

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I’d be interested to know what you’ve worked on as a designer?

More bank space is coming… See the road map in the last update notes.

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I’ve been a designer for 15 years and 5 years in QA before that, so a fair few games!
I’ve worked on lots of little known games, and some bigger ones.
Lets just say I’ve worked on nearly all the main genres either as a Level designer, Game Designer or both.

I’ve worked on a PS2 CoD game, a Black Hawk Down game, Broken Sword game. I’ve worked at Sony, EA etc

None of that really matters to be honest, as it’s just personal opinions of the kind of game I’d like to play, and I can’t expect my opinion to matter vs millions of contrary opinions.
But we’re all just venting :slight_smile:

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Yeah thanks. I know it’s coming. That’s why i stated I’d be back when they do it.
It’ll all work out…well except for the ridiculously high legendary drop rates…but I can live with that

Its like you where in the room when I was explaining why I’m getting sooooooooo fkd off with the entire game, it shows just how universal the feeling is. All because some half wit was more bothered about lighting effects or how stunning they made a cutscene that lasts 20 secs rather than the actual CORE, Essence of the game itself

And even now after weeks of every fkin player on the planet telling them the same thing, “ITS RUINING THE GAME”,
what do we get more content and no where to put one FKIN item without throwing away gear its taken weeks of gameplay to get hold of, and yes we know its coming eventually, there should be NO EVENTUALY, ITS the NUMBER ONE THING FOR EVERY PLAYER THAT THEY UTTERELY FKD UP,

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Oh ■■■■, you worked on Black hawk down? Ahh tournament memories.

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Hey I realise me asking may have come across as aggressive, I didn’t mean it that way. I was just genuinely curious. You make some good points, although some of what you say is being addressed soon in updates, as others have said.

You’re welcome to go and play something else. You clearly don’t understand that.

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As opposed to getting everything from [insert favorite farm here]?

I mean folks are going to kill things again and again to get their optimal build anyways, assigning drops encourages people to fight different things and that’s not bad like you’re making it out to be…

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I’d disagree with you, but something tells me you would just tell me I don’t know my own opinion lol. It’s alright to be passionate but you should really consider not speaking for everyone.

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I am the same kind of player, I like the thrill of the hunt. Problem with BL3 is that some legendaries are ■■■■. Im ok in not getting a legendary every 30 mins but what happen if the only one you get out of your 5 hour playing is a stupid ASMD sniper again?

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Dedicated loot is coming, I just hope they do something with the proving grounds. Its the perfect setup for fun farming. Proving grounds are fun but it doesnt give anything to do it.

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Proving grounds has been it’s own mess, at least as far as I’m concerned. I can get enemies to spawn faster on world maps, why there’s an optional objective to complete with X time remaining when I’m sitting waiting for enemies to spawn so I can progress is just sad…

That being said, it would be pretty cool if assigned drops weren’t just to bosses (or rare spawns). I think with as many as we have to obtain certain enemies (like dark Maliwan troops or guardians) could have chances to proc particular ones making proving grounds more appealing too.

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yeah, I would like that.

My point [quote=“bvhjdbvkjf.unhacked, post:10, topic:4010939, full:true”]

As opposed to getting everything from [insert favorite farm here]?

I mean folks are going to kill things again and again to get their optimal build anyways, assigning drops encourages people to fight different things and that’s not bad like you’re making it out to be…
[/quote]

My point about this is they (IMO) make things spawn on certain bosses. Everything except loot that is specific to that boss (the unique blues with red text for example) should be a world spawn, so there is no one place to get anything and you may as well run around all over. Yes I know, there’ll always be bosses with certain drop rates that are higher and they will be targeted by the players instead, but that’s up to the devs to balance, or make the journey to those with higher drop rates a bit more inconvenient.

You HAVE to have risk/reward mechanics in a game like this I believe and with such a huge amount of content that for most players will never be walked again, because there is no boss there who has a higher drop rate is kinda f*****g yourself over, as a game I think.

I seem to be the only one who is happy with most things being in a universal world drop category, but then I accept I am not the norm.

Agreed. I want appreciate the loot that I get along the way. Knowing where that loot comes from diminishes that feeling.

I’ve accepted the high legendary drop rates, because getting the right annointed legendary is the goal.

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we can have both. Slaughter shaft is pretty much only mobs, theres no boss there.

The world drops haven’t been a bother for me. I kind of dig it. It allows you to run quite a bit of content without really losing the glimmer of new or better Legendaries yet to drop. In fact with the Luck Guardian keystone and some points invested in Luck (mine is at 13.07), on TVHM’s MH3, i find Legendaries all the time from not only regular mobs but ordinary chests, and i still haven’t touched anything near all of the Lengendaries in the game. I will say that typically “meta” guns do seem to have a lower overall drop rate, typically it’s clunkers like the Woodblock etc, but it’s enough to keep me grinding at this point.

The bank thing is truly one of the most tilting things about it so far. I have 2 level 50 toons i play alot and try to keepat least 15 Inventory slots on apiece. Begrudgingly i have a 3rd toon to level 11 with a few upgrades to Inv space buti refuse to Min/Max beyond that concession.

I play solo too and haven’t yet run trials and only Cistern of Slaughter so far. One thing they could do for the QoL of those type of events is keep a Quick Change Station so you could respec w/0 forfeiting completed rounds

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I don’t think I understand you here…

So you want to be able to repeat the exact same content over and over again? If the devs balance it all, make it so no boss does more lot than another, and keep world drops - that’s all you’ll get.

I’m not here for an easy out personally, different bosses should be different difficulties… Every fight should not be the same or all you’ll end up with is no longevity in the game.

World drops is (as evidenced by the number of times graveward has been killed) exactly how you eliminate the risk factor in the game. Assigned pools are how you establish the risk factor again and prevent content from being outdated.

This is actually not a productive means to promote replayability, not with world drops. All you’ll get is a balance team continually trying to make it so one spot is not preferred over others. Then people will come to the forums to complain and get recommendations when they see the rate they’re farming at impacted. Everyone will go back to killing just one boss even if the team ends up changing the profitability margin…

And as a developer yourself in sure you can imagine much better things for them to be working on yeah?

Well, we kind of already do. Smart Gun XXL comes to mind. Rare spawns. I guess players just want meta items to have increased drop rates from a known source. Depending on how Gbx implements it, I shouldn’t be affected.

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