The least played raid in the history of the franchise needs fixing!

Which kinda is just plain counter intuitive to their whole effort to do more coop in raiding.

And with a tad bit of effort…they could fix it methinks.

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They would need to make modifiers way less intrusive. Nobody is going to run on a team of randoms when the rogue light modifier is on or when the immune elements modifier is on.

Or they need to give members of matchmade teams the ability to respawn after a short cooldown. Otherwise players are just going to disconnect as soon as they die or their teammates die

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Not trying to be dismissive, just trying to understand , I didn’t find Torgue particularly different in difficulty from the other 3 big BL2 DLCs.
Only real “challenge” in it was the stupid metal T-Rex, and once one discovered how to manage it from the entrance that was straightforward. Of course Pyro Pete is a raid boss, but he’s the easiest of the BL2 raids to do solo.
Oh, and Tina’s quest to help her pet skag is annoying, particularly in UVHM, but not hard.

Nothing, to me, like this Takedown. What was the particular mechanic or mission in the Torgue DLC is the equivalent of this Takedown?

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If you’re on pc I’ll run it with you haha. Ive completed it probably 100 times solo, it’s not that bad once you get all the mechanics down.

The mechanics aren’t very hard either, the main issue is that it’s so long, takes about 30 minutes for drops that aren’t guaranteed which really bums me out.

No need to waste who knows what development resources to make the raid more appealing. Just don’t fix the skips and grant at least one of each dedicated drops from each boss. Right now with Moze I can finish the raid in 15/20 minutes by using all the exploits I know.
Many people are against skips and such, but if you don’t like the content but want the rewards… After all I’ve never used any glitch to make the Maliwan Takedown shorter since I like the map… It’s not a matter of skipping difficult sections, but to make it shorter time wise.

Maliwan Takedown is possibly the most fun BL raid I’ve ever played. It is still a piece of content I’ll regularly go run just for the pure enjoyment of it.

Guardian Takedown tried something new, but with the crystal charging, platforming, and immunity phases, it makes it feel artificially slow, and that makes it feel like a slog. In the Maliwan run, you decide how long it takes you to complete it. In the Guardian run, you have a ton of stop point no matter how strong your build is.

It’s a beautiful run, and I dont see the immunity phases going away, but those aside, I think they could do several things that would make this run a lot more fun. I actually LOVE the run, but the length combined with lack of spawn points can make it really brutal.

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I don’t understand the points players make regarding save points. It’s a takedown/raid that’s suppose to challenge you. Providing additional save points makes it easier to complete.

I’ve fallen or missed platforms playing with another player, but that was because his internet was sketchy (from Australia and I’m in the US). So that wasn’t GBX’s fault. Skips and exploits are not part of the vision the game devs had… So using those is just stupid, imo. If you love using then, go ahead, but you won’t get any kudos from me.

That I will agree with.

Yes. I don’t mind the combat being hard, that is why I said it was supposed to be hard. I was referencing the poster above who said the crystal bit was a struggle.

Personally, I find the combat OK. It is very challenging, as I would expect, and is only really achievable with the best builds. No throwing a build together and ripping right through it.

The bit I absolutely hate is the platforming though. I am not the best platformer in the world so maybe my opinion isn’t worth much, but I would say the platforming is very unforgiving. Is it supposed to be like that? I would have thought that the map designers thought not. But maybe they are better platformers than me and they breezed it.

What annoys me about the raid is that I have the same chance at failing it no matter if it is Mayhem 0 or Mayhem 10, due to the platforming.

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I love platformers. I’m of the unpopular opinion that platforming has a place in BL. The consequence for dying though isn’t proportional.

Look at Doom Eternal: you can play the game on its most challenging mode but the game won’t make you do an entire section of a map + mobbing just to get to the point of a simple jump puzzle.

If I die in platforming, I redo the platforming. If I die in mobbing, I redo the mobbing. I think sectioning off checkpoints would feel more fair. At the very most have a small mobbing map before the jump puzzle. Obviously you can get better over time and stop caring, but the first time you do it should be fun too yes?

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I’m not sure I am getting any better. The platforming feels like a complete change in pace. I mean, you just finish off a load of mobs the you have to stop, change pace and thought process, to do the jumping. Feels like chessboxing :rofl:

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lol exactly. theres something so jarring abt not pressing space bar at the right time ONCE then suddenly i have to charge crystals and kill the tankiest mobs in the game again lol

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Good points. Don’t get me wrong, I would love to see it more playable. Hopefully if GBX gets some spare cycles they can work on it.

And maybe I’m dead wrong :slight_smile: I’m OK with that :slight_smile:

When you ask it like this, I can make it a lot easier for you. It depends on the char. Axton, Salvador and Maya can take on Badassasaurus Rex but the other three struggle at taking him down. Zer0 has massive damage at range but it’s all reduced to nothing with Badass Rex’s massive DR. Krieg cries because he’s constantly left at healthgate and can’t really do anything to just off him in a quick second, Gaige I assume from what I know on her really just doesn’t like all the power, she’s more of a mobber as is.

All I was saying is there have been things equally as tedious in the history of Borderlands add-ons. It seems some here have figured out the raid’s particular nuances and how to complete it, so it’s not impossible by any means.

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Thanks! I am Johnrr6 on steam…hit me with a friend request.

I am a terrible platformer…hence part of my frustration…

I can’t help it… the original post is funny and honest.

This is Borderlands. We want to Run N Gun!

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Here’s my reasoning and feel free to disagree.

It’s a reward…

Progress…and you get a reward for it. The whole precept behind a loot shooter.

Not having them simply increases the difficulty artificially as well as the frustration level.

in my mind…a good game respects a players time. Save points respect a players time investment to this particular point.

Not having them…doesn’t.

Even as wild and mechanics filled…and LONG as D2 Raids are…they almost always have save points right before major platforming/jumping puzzle areas.

I do disagree on most of your points. But it’s all subjective, honestly (from our perspectives) . The thing is, if we look at the takedowns (from the devs point of view), they are suppose to be challenging. The ultimate reward is finishing it. I’ll tell you this: all my runs on both the MTD and the GTD have been generous in the rewards ( I play solely in M10). Most of the time I don’t pick anything up because I already have just about all that I need in terms of gear.

If GBX were to introduce more save points in the GTD, then they stray from the established plan they already have for them. One save point, a midway boss fight, and an ending boss fight against an invincible opponent. More save points in the GTD deviates from the blueprint they obviously use for takedowns.

I was annoyed at first, but I felt the same way about the MTD. Once I mastered the platforms, the whole run is relatively easy. Yes, GBX introduced some mandatory time extensions for the two major bosses, but they are not that difficult to defeat. We must also remember that if we are soloing the takedowns, they were meant for teams to tackle. So, the crystal sections are more difficult and time consuming because they are geared towards multiplayers/teams. To be able to solo either takedown is a feat upon a feat, and doing so should be reward enough. And, keeping in mind, that this content is free. That is to say, it shouldn’t suck. I don’t think either takedown sucks. The GTD is just lengthier.

If you ever want to run through either one, I’m online often and we are already connected through Epic/Shift.

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I’ve solo the raid 2 times, 8 with a party. The lootsplosion after all that work is so depressing. Not to mention teleporters just dont appear during the teleporting phase sometimes. Definitely buggy aswell.

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I understand this point of view and perhaps that was designer’s intent (may be they will tell us at some point). I suspect the reason quite a few folks voice their concerns about Guardian Takedown in general and platforming/crystal charging in particular is that it does not seem to fit the rest of the game.

Most of combat in BL is heavily gear-dependent, and rewards are loot-based as well, IMHO: If you have good guns, precise aiming is not that needed; if you beat a tough enemy, they drop something decent. Players have been conditioned through all previous games that a) precise timing and hand-eye coordination are not a must, and b) there is a reasonable correlation between the effort and rewards.

Guardian Takedown breaks both of these: you are expected to execute precise jumps and your loot reward is not that great given the time commitment, effort, and likely a decent number of failures one had to endure. Now, anyone who relishes overcoming a complex challenge might be quite happy with Takedown design (although I’m not sure why they would do it again and again) - but I suspect it’s not the core audience of Borderlands.

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I’m not even going to try the GTD. Getting all of the Crimson Radio challenges were tough enough for me to hate platforming.

If GBX wants to have artificial difficulty with lack of checkpoints, let’s make people redo story mode whenever they die.

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