The nerf of Moze

I’m not all that thrilled with the nerf to nade Moze. Probably the most fun I’ve had in this game since I started playing. Granted, I can see where they would think that this is a problem, it really shouldn’t be. This is said with taking into consideration the near uselessness of Iron Bear once you start stepping into Mayhem modes. Once you’re in Mayhem, Iron Bear gradually falls off into a useless skill. FL4K, Zane, and Amara all have builds that center around their skills, while Moze…has to compensate. Even if you full spec for Iron Bear, it’s still useless. It can’t take much abuse, it’s damage output is mediocre, and so far the only decent use it’s had has been a bullet sponge, or a quick escape.

If they’re going to hit her with nerfs, then they need to give her skill some love beforehand. You should WANT to be in Iron Bear as often as possible, or have it following you around as often as possible. It shouldn’t be a back thought where you just toss it out with the only intention of procing anointed gear or as a “I’m big, hit me!” target for a few seconds. I would be a lot more okay with the nerf, if they would at least address this. However, they’re more worried about Borderlands being a game of “balance” now it would seem, when, as I recall, this franchise circles around the ability to come up with absurd builds and gear combinations that are hilariously game breaking (coughSalvadorcough).

I realize that the 2 seconds re-trigger delay isn’t a MASSIVE nerf. If anything it’s an annoyance, but enough of one that it hurts the build, and definitely makes it less fun. If forces micromanagement, and the need to be a little less of a maniac mindlessly throwing as fast as your arm will let you. Sure, I understand all of that, but again, that comes back to the fact of what else does she have to fall back on? Buff the mech Gearbox, before you start hammering her with nerfs.

All comments are personal opinions of a crybaby that just likes throwing endless nades like a psychotic maniac. Also loves mechs.


Welcome to the chorus. This is what most everyone is saying, and what most everyone expects.

Unfortunately, we’re in that limbo before action so everyone is upset. At least Gearbox have noted issues with Iron Bear and intention to solve.

We’re in the but(t) stage of that quote. We all want to get in the front of that.

The nade nerf wasn’t impactful at all and it actually brought some balance, which is good. We still get grenade ammo and grenade per 10 kills from guardian ranks. It was a good change that didn’t actually modify the power of the build, rather the spamability of it.


I get what your saying but honestly I tried the nerf yesterday in circle of slaughter mayhem 3 and all it did after I threw all my grenades was use a fast fire rate weapon like shreddifier and spray explosions every where (I have the explosive punctuation capstone if it helps any )

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it get fixed though aoon I made front page tread to Randy Picthflop.


She has multiple strong builds. Have you tried adding a launcher to fire in between nade spam? Maybe a Hive - it’s mindless. Doesn’t even really require changing the build, but lowers grenades per second to better keep pace with current regen. Homing Mirv Tediores can also be very mindless (and maintaining shotgun ammo is amusingly easy with the right gear).

There’s also two other trees to build around and each has at least one build that’s very strong for a significant area of the game. And a ton of guns to utilize, rather than a singular grenade as the start and end of what’s needed for offense against 98% of the game.

So basically, explore the character more. Moze got away with a slap on the wrist compared to FL4K.

You get bonus points for not mindlessly asking “why not just buff everything else to Moze’s level!?”


Are you serious? Even after the nerf she’s still pretty much in God Mode. I can sit in Shaft of Slaughter on Mayhem 3 and literally face tank everything whilst just pressing “G” and holding down LMB while the rest of my team actually has to utilize something that resembles skill to stay alive. She was broken and still is.

This game is dying…at this point who cares. Just let it be Novemever so I can play RDR2 on PC.

see bahroos quick post nerf video and again state how the nade build is ruined :smirk:

There is no data to support this statement. Just because a few people are posting on forums about their displeasure, does not mean “the game is dying”.

It’s also only been out for less than a month, so there’s that to consider. There are still new players arriving every other day. The only thing that’s dying is FL4K’s usage.

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Moze has a couple great builds for consistent DPS.

Of course, her best build right now, from what I understand is - her Deathless build. She’s basically a glass cannon, except you can still take some serious punishment.

(Leaving Subject!) I have my own personal modified version of this build, though, allowing me even greater DPS. Basically a lucky God-Tier set.

As I equip the Deathless artifact to bring my health down to 1, I can use the Grave artifact. Because, with the Front Loader shield, and Desperate Enhanced Bloodletter, you can stay at 1 health.

Back on subject here.

Everyone is either crying about the nerf, or they’re shrugging it off.

You can compensate for the nerf by using certain grenades, such as the Hex grenade.

However, people seem to forget that this build isn’t only for grenades. That nerf almost broke my Flakker. There’s one thing to be said about having infinite ammo, and another to be said about using a gun that consumes the most ammo in the game.

Of course, weapon diversity is also a thing. But I find that almost all of them suck, and/or aren’t suited for Moze.

Meanwhile, I concur with this post. To my knowledge, Moze is the only character in the game who has only received nerfs, and not buffs.

Sure, you can walk around with God-Tier kits, but that gets boring after awhile. Gearbox is supposedly trying to encourage build diversity by nerfing certain skills. Yet, they aren’t noticeably buffing anything else to make a different build viable? Hmm.

As the author here said - her mech is most useful for removing a DoT or using last second to prevent something that would otherwise kill you. When you jump into it, you basically enter roughly a 5 second invulnerability phase where nothing can kill you.

Except for One Punch Man, which is amusing in itself. He’ll kill you during that phase, and you’ll be ------ if you have nothing else around you.

Otherwise speaking, she really has nothing else to fall back on, except maybe one other build. She basically has one build.

So, come on people, have some sympathy!

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You’re just going to have to trust me. The signs are there. I been through the same thing with Division 2 and Anthem.

Sign 1: Twitch viewership has dropped nearly 99% since launch.

Sign 2: YouTube videos are getting no traction.

If people are not interested in Borderlands content…that means they are not playing the game. This game is in trouble.

Or…that they are playing the game instead of watching YouTube?


Everyone can lie to themselves till the cows come home. You heard it here first.

I beg your pardon?
I’d welcome a pm explaining that comment.

We are ignoring warning signs, it’s not a personal attack. That’s why I said “Everyone”

Where do you get your numbers from? 99% less viewrship on twitch? On the channels you’re watching then or just your own channel…?

How do you even know the youtube videoes don’t get traction? Is it just your own channel? ><

Your numbers seem off dude.

Not terribly sure what exactly do you expect?

It’s Borderlands, a single player game. Vast majority of people will just do the campaign and that’s it, then some like me will go anal farming for a couple of weeks until inevitably we get bored of doing same thing and go for other games until DLC comes out, then maybe check it out.

It’s a typical Borderlands cycle. There will always be dedicated people who will nolife it for thousands of hours, but vast, vast majority of players will just do that one campaign and be done with it.

Im not off…that’s just one of the signs.

-Twitch viewership dropping like a comet.
-YouTube views down.
-Still no performance fixes nearly 1 month out.
-Constant complaints on the forums.

  • And the most telling, and what killed the Division 2. A split player base. Half of the people want nerfs and balance, half want the opposite. I’ve seen it before, half the Division wanted a PVE Darkzone, Half wanted a PVP Darkzone…end result. The game pleased no one. What ended up happening was things were nerfed for PVP and ended up affecting PVE. Gearbox is in a unwinnable situation.

Moze nerf was really tiny and did not quite do what it was advertised to do. I’d expect them slap on one more nerf, because this one did almost nothing really.

The only real effect is that your gun can potentially run out of ammo now, but grenades with Hex? Nope. Same goes for immortality, still there.