The problem with balance and a solution! Ideas from the top 1% to help everyone else

The problem is some of us (myself included) are performing spectacularly…we are tilting the game. Mayhem 3 was nothing for us so they had to make a Mayhem 4. Now mayhem 4 is nothing to us. The problem is people like me will get the best drops that enable us to just steamroll the game because we are performing so well gearbox does not know how to balance the game. The way to fix it has nothing to doing with nerfing anything. Because everything they’ve nerfed we’ve just found a new build and continue to destroy mayhem 4. The solution is to balance the game so that people that aren’t performing as well get a bump in loot chance that would help them get to the next lvl of play. While at the same time just leaving the top 1% alone…because in reality there’s nothing they can do to stop us. And balancing a game based on what the top 1% can do affects the other 99% severely…but only temporarily hurts the 1%. Does that make sense?


Well put, to add perspective: less than 5% of players have beaten Circles, even on normal M0 (PS trophies).


100% right.

Trying to “balance” the game based on YouTube videos is insane! If the best items get nerfed into the ground to put a cap on how fast some YouTuber can beat the raid, the average player will not stand a chance against the most difficult content.

Additional perspective: Farming the gear to match the bulk of the builds on YouTube would take 100s if not 1000s of hours. The YouTubers are buying gear that is not even farm-able in game and using it to show some “hypothetical” build that “could” be attained.

If the average player has a couple of pieces of gear for a build, and then they get nerfed, the harm is great. If a top 1% gets their gear nerfed, they’ll either simply buy more, or else go to one of their dozens of mule characters to grab the “new best thing”. Balancing content around these animals is not only challenging, but will serve to make the game worse for the average player.


Lol I have 528 hours…or 22 days worth of playtime. There’s no way a normal player could keep up…so I think my idea would work really well for everyone!

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More power to you. And I agree, there is no way that I could keep up with that :).

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The problems with this game stem more from unintuitive skills/combos, anointments, and poor or non existent scaling. There are interactions between some skills or passives that just don’t work the way they are described due to bugs or due to what most of us call “Gearbox Math” where an equation constantly produces a new total before applying another multiplication or devision.

Of course having Annoited gear hasn’t helped the games balance at all. In fact most of the best anoitments break the game difficulty so much that it makes you wonder how some can be so good and other so bad.
Some anoints are beyond the strength of any skill seen in the series history like Amaras, Melee damage after Phaeslam or here gun damage after Phaecast.

Tweaking drop rates is something the game needs yes but is dosen’t do much to solve the major problems like Fakegrasp abuse, A mech that dies faster than a tink on fire, or anointed gear being so variable in power.

The RNG on things like anointments is so randome players ether cheat or trade with someone who dupped a god tire drop. I’m not saying doing any of that is wrong or right all I’m saying is the in game systems do little to encourage or help me to farm the same piece of gear for hours on end for the simple chance at the gear getting any kind of good anointment.

Lastly scaling is just uhhhhhh. God I got so board during the last half of the game. The only thing that kept me going was the story and the knowledge that there was endgame activities. I mean I guess once I saw how scaling and level changes had been handled when joining lower level players I should have known that the Pets and the mech would just not be scaled for Mayhem mode. I want to clarify I don’t blame GBX for the short sights but at the same time I don’t see how stuff like this slid by when testing the game. It make me wonder how extensive there testing process actually is.

I think one of the best solutions to help fix the game would be for GBX to start taking more time to focus on what is and isn’t working in the game, and work piece by piece on solutions to each individual issue and see how the game experience changes. Rushing to add in new modes, DLCs and level increases is great I love the flow of content BUT NOT AT THE COST OF QUALITY!!! I cannot stress that enough. As a Battleborn veteran they frequently disregarded the quality of the game and broke simple yet major feature of the game and kept adding content and skins without addressing the fans and telling us why these issues were not being addressed.

Transparency and communication are important but so is taking the time to deliver the quality your loyal fans deserve.


I know what you mean with Amara…my main is and always will be Moze. The plus elemental next two magazines never runs out. I have a tsunami that does rad next two mags. That means I am dealing fire(from skills)/shock/corrosive/radiation/regular damage on one gun that shoots several bullets for the price of one ammo. I have annihilated “driver Amaras” in duels because they can’t go fast enough before I can deal every element in the game before they can react. With just a 2x mag rad anoited tsunami, a shock anointed Cryo Mirv-tacular hex and an atom bomb with + weapon and + smg dmg. Amara is not as powerful as you think vs. some other builds from Moze, Zane.


You know I was about to make a long winded post but you kind of nailed what I was going to say. You are absolutely correct. What did the moze and fl4k nerfs accomplish? Fl4k still dumps on bosses with fade away and moze is still chucking grenades and blowing everything up (albeit much more clunky}

I say the hell with it, buff them back up, buff the loot back up too. We have a bunch of anointments (a decent amount of fluff ones too) and only more will be added which will pollute the loot pool further. We need those legendaries dropping a lot to have a shot at getting the right one. Did these people who asked for less loot not realize what hole they were digging? Try buffing it back up gearbox, see how it works, what’s it going to hurt?

And the last note about balance…if they go the route of nerfing…it’s going to be a black hole of game design. You are right, they will nerf one thing, people will just do something else…nerf…something else and so on. It would literally never stop and we will end up with a game nobody wants to play, simple as that.


Here’s a simple solution. Instead of using cheesy builds and gear that do insane amounts of damage and complaining about how everything is too easy and boring. Put away the garbage builds and gear use an original build and use nothing but common to rare gear on everything.
Then try the easy and boring content again. If it’s still too easy and boring than fine, go ahead and complain about it.
If you can’t stop yourself from exploitations and basically breaking the game then your the problem, not the game.
So no matter how hard they try to make the game more challenging your going to try to exploit the game to make it no challenge at all.
So it’s basically NEVER going to work.

This isn’t directed towards any single person. I just saying this in general. So please don’t respond to this as some form of personal attack if your perception is that I’m talking about you.


I agree…I use a build that no one ever thought would work and I’ve never posted the details. Gearbox can see the items that all of our characters have equipped and what builds are used most frequently and react based on that. I believe my solution would work well because it doesn’t require anyone to have any particular build to do anything. It allows people to use what they like and have an easier time reaching the level of gameplay they want without constricting them to one playstyle/build/gear.

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But MOST importantly my idea is NOT to nerf anything to achieve balance…I forgot to say that.

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I kind of silly when people are constantly complaining that everything too easy and boring. When they key hole themselves into the cheesist character builds and gear basically breaking the game mechanics and then cry everything too easy and has to be balanced around around some cheesy key holed build and gear.
This how BL2 started the insanity with everything trying to be balanced around the bee shield and Salvador as the bar of what to balance content around.
If your constantly using the most OP character, weapons, builds and gear than your going to be the reason why nothing is challenging not the game. There’s plenty of challenging content already if your not basically exploiting the game.


So, I like that this is an alternative way to try to balance things, but I think it has it’s own problems.

-How would the game judge if you’re doing good or bad? By how often we die? Some people struggle, but don’t die too often though.

-Would the game give less loot to players that do well? Or would the loot be not as good?

-And, wouldn’t this encourage players to just fake being bad to get more/better loot? If it’s tied to character or profile, they’ll just make an alt character or profile, fake struggle on there, and transfer the loot to their main.


If you don’t have the loot in your inventories or in your stash seems like a good place to start

But isn’t finding a viable or OP approach the whole purpose of the game? I mean, you struggle in the beginning, things are tough, so you find our what works? I heard on PC , though, it’s possible to use someone else’s save? That would shorten the replay value quite a bit I imagine, even though you’d still have to learn how to use everything.

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So you mean the game would check your character’s inventory, and would drop loot based on that?

I think that is what players are supposed to aim for, but never actually achieve. The game is intended to keep you from exploiting it or from making a build that just destroys everything it can throw at you. Basically, the aim for the devs is to keep the challenge, but still make the player feel powerful. The aim for the player is to try to outsmart the devs, but actually achieving this just makes the challenge die. It is a strange dynamic indeed.


Yup…gearbox already keeps tabs on builds and gear that players are using so I’m sure they could figure it out somehow

I’m just trying to think how they would want it to affect loot drops though. Would having a lot of legendaries make the game drop less legendaries? Then players will just switch them to other accounts to grind for legendaries. Some players will just always try to find new ways to cheat the system.

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All accounts are linked in the primary profile…the stash is at least

I think I mentioned that before, if it goes by profile, then they’d just have two profiles. I know, this is probably annoying, but people love to find loopholes. Especially gamers.

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