Thoughts on competitive matchmaking

Battleborn Battleborn Competitive Multiplayer Discussion
#2

ELO still can’t be used because of the player count but we could have another ranking system. Something that doesn’t influence who you play(yet) but maybe a tier based reward system.
The lower ELO/ rank of the opposition, the less points you gain for a win and the more you lose for a loss, towards your next rank (standard ranking)

Rating based off k/d and score could lead too intentionally prolonging matchs to boost. Basing it solely off a win reward for the winning team and a skill judgement for the losers would work better.

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#3

Competitive matchmaking will be just as dead as capture and meltdown. The player base is not large enough for a competitive queue and regular queues, even if they combine capture and meltdown.

Why do we only have one PvP queue?
#4

Did you look through my suggestion?
If they gave enough of an incentive to play the competitive queue, once it became popular enough it could replace the normal queue.
I don’t mean it would be taken out of the game but the majority of player would migrate.

#5

I did read your suggestions but I didn’t understand them because they don’t address the problem with MM or the game. The problem has nothing to do with how they calculate ELO, no matter how flawed it is, it has to do with how many people are playing the game. Adding another queue when the three they have aren’t used correctly won’t help.

Now, if there where thousands of players wanting to play this game, then that would be a different story.

#6

My suggestion points out that ELO can’t be a factor in Competitive MM because as you and I said the number of players can’t currently support it. I was thinking of something more along the lines of a scaling reward system based off the ELO or rank of your opponent(not the MM itself). We can’t have balanced matchs yet but we can have a mode that encourages serious play with a tournament ruleset.

I’m saying that if its good enough, it could replace incursion (again not replace, player migration)

#7

Duplicate characters aside, turning off ELO for the Chaos Rumble queue has resulted in the most properly matched by command rank matches I have seen since…well…since last Chaos Rumble.

KEEP ELO OFF!!!

#8

But how do you properly balance matches? A CR 100 could be worse than a CR 25 in PVP

#9

Sadly this is probably for the best for now.
I think the ELOs unbalancing comes from balancing a team at a time and just can’t work right now in MM.

That being said, my idea has nothing to do with using ELO to match player, being used instead for ranking purposes to determine placement up/down.

#10

I think we should be able to see our rankings. Just have a three tiered system. For example, Friendship Raider, Penarch Warrior, and then Solus Guardian. Like bronze, silver, and gold. If you win, you move up five points and drop 2 for losing. That becomes 4 and 3 in silver. Then 3 and 3. Hit 100 points and advance to the next tier, but you can’t drop back down to silver or bronze. Hit 50 on gold and get a gold skin for someone. 100 and a cyber skin. Make it seasonal, with new skins and refreshed rankings per season. You can’t see others rankings though unless you’re friends with them. Premades… idk what to do about them. Does that make sense or am I raving?

#11

@epicender584
That seems pretty standard tier based ranking and I’m right there with you.

Problem is we don’t have the player for fair MM and that’s why I proposed a proportionate to ELO win/loss ranking system.

Win less when against less skilled players

Lose less when your the only one pulling your weight.

It would help with rage quitting to know that if your still working hard a loss won’t mean much but if you quit it’s a max penalty

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#12

Currently 281 on PC… think the only MM that works with that many people is a Quick Match button (more 5 man premades oh boy) or a server browser.

#13

What if they did a New Ranking system ONLY for competitive.E
everybody starts at the bottom, in a couple weeks rhe ranks will speak for themselves in terns of team balance.
Base the rank off of Competitive Wins VS Loses an have big penalties for quitters and disable surrender.
OR
They cld even set the Competitive on a 4 month rotation, meaning every four months the ranks all reset an you start at the bottom of the pool again.
Rank each player on wins and loses but into a Platinum, Gold, Silver, and Bronze rankings.
At the end of each “Season” give awards based off Rank.
Skins, platinum, credits, good loot packs, etc etc.
Gives everybody more reason to play an return each rotation.

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#14

Pretty much how I would imagine it.
But MM atill wouldnt have the players for balanced play. A system would have to be in play to balance rewards for imbalanced matches. A highly skilled player shouldn’t be heavily penalized for being put on a poor team.

#15

But if everyone starts at Competitive Rank 1 theb how wld you kno who are the good players and who are the bad?
Those early loses wont even matter in the long run. An if possible they cld even do it so that each Season your rank reset at one cld be like a Gold 1 an it wld match you according to old rank and win streak for the start up.

#16

It’s not about determining who is good or bad. It’s about dealing with the low player count and the fact that the best 5 man premade team in the competitive queue might not have anyone to play with but random groups of new players and…

1 they shouldn’t be denied the chance to play
2 they shouldn’t be consistently rewarded for stomping the same team.
3 skilled solo player shouldn’t be punished for being matched with a bad team.

If there are enough players to fairly match teams on skill, we should go with that but we don’t have that luxury right now.

#17

Well unless everybody is unwilling to bite the bullet an just get over it an take that chance,
Theres no way to determine skill based off of anything we have now aside from Co.mand Rank an thats a garbage thing to go off of, ive played plenty of unimpressive CR 100s.
Do you have anything to suggest?

#18

We should still track skill and rank the player accordingly and a point system based on the skill and W/L and who your competing against.

This ranking would determine your rewards tier and your overall skill but (for right now) wouldn’t solely determine who your matched against.

I’ll give some hypotheticals on how teams would be graded
Well call the ranking value CP
Everyone starts at CP 100

2 even teams play A&B
Team average cp 100 vs 100

Team A Wins
P1 +10 cp
P2 +10 cp
P3 +10 cp
P4 +10 cp
P5 +10 cp

Team B loses
P1 K/D/A 0/12/5 -10cp
P2 K/D/A 2/10/2 -10cp
P3 K/D/A 5/5/0 -5cp
P4 K/D/A 0/2/15 -5cp
P4 K/D/A 15/1/3 -1cp

2 mismatched teams play
Team average cp 200 vs 50

Team A Wins
P1 +2cp
P2 +2cp
P3 +2cp
P4 +2cp
P5 +2cp

Team B loses
P1 K/D/A 0/12/5 -5cp
P2 K/D/A 2/10/2 -5cp
P3 K/D/A 5/5/0 -1cp
P4 K/D/A 0/2/15 -1cp
P4 K/D/A 15/1/3 +2cp

The values would have to be fine tuned but something like that.

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#19

Having a ladder season in Battleborn sounds definitely intriguing.
Especially if only the k-value (maximum points to gain in a match) is affected by your Ranking.

I personally don’t like different Tiers of Ranking (like Bronze/Silver/Gold) and I believe GBX’s decision to not show your ELO ranking comes from the same thought. The devs don’t wan’t to create an elitist ‘upper class’ in their playerbase.

However, with such a ranking not affecting the actual Matchmaking I could see it work.
(As with a certain difference in Ranking, the pros that eventually stomp you would actually not gain anything from it.)

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#20

This example you give strongly reminds me of a better version of the Evolve Ranking system they have.
I cld agree with this, as long as its handled carefully and well.
I just want Competitive to not show CR as well. It is not a good indication of skill.
However i do beleive you shld have to hit CR 10 before you can play the Competitive mode that way it forces new players to play PVE or sum casual PVP an actually understand what their doing before jumping in an having their Competitive Rank horribly skewed forever becasue of their own ignorance

#21

Yeah that’s my plan
The hope is that because you only get rewarded for winning, there would be no point to stalling matchs and you would go for the win as fast as possible. You wouldn’t want to mess around and torture the poor new players because if they turn it around and barely sneak out a victory, you get hit hard. if the penalty for losing against high ranked player is much lower then quitting, then there would be far fewer disconnects.

It could work well with our current player counts but it would have to be fine tuned, implemented well, and hopefully embraced by the player base.

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