Thoughts on Mayhem vs. OP levels

I just launched BL3 again after 2 weeks or so of playing BL1 and 2 instead.

And was thinking about Mayhem levels on weapons, and their visibility on item cards soon.
This highlighted what I consider a major difference between OP and Mayhem. Something that’s really obvious, but really changes how I think about “above level cap” weapons.

Of course, in BL2 to use a OP3 weapon, you (your character) also had to be OP3. Which meant that you farmed/collected your best weapons for each OP level (or really about every 3 OP levels you’d re-farm). And you’d have those to pass to new characters as they level up.

With Mayhem that’s not true. A level 57 Mayhem 10 weapon is usage by any level 57 character, no matter what the Mayhem level selected is. You can have Mayhem OFF and use a Mayhem 10 OPQ, even if the character wielding it has never played with Mayhem active.
This is a significant change. Any new character hitting lvl 57 gets all the best weapons at his or her disposal, no slow climb up to get the premium stuff.

Is this good or bad? I don’t know yet, right now it just is. Does take the challenge of a Digistruct Peak type proving ground away from new characters, and Im not sure I philosophically agree with that. Then again, I don’t have to grind through something like D.P. to get to use the good stuff, which is pretty nice.

I dunno, maybe a hybrid model might be good? Your character can’t use a M-8 weapon unless he or she has actually triggered and played in M-8? That seems a bit contrived and useless, though.

Thoughts? Does this new way of getting the top end gear to new character suit you or not?


Welcome back :wink:

Ongoing discussion about past difficulty implementation and current here.

I myself don’t see a problem with the character being able to grab an M10 right away.
In the old BL3 system, weapons were only locked by level, so once everybody was at 57, they could use anything anyway. Originally, there were no additional “levels” added to a weapon. Everything was an M0 weapon. Some were just better than others to be used in M4.
The decision to scale weapons by MH level is new, and was not thought out very well at all judging by the implementation.
Only time will tell how this is going to play out.

BL3 is different from how OP levels were done so I don’t even compare the two. I myself was not a big fan of how OP levels worked.


You had to be at least OP3 to use that weapon. You could then set the game to OP1 and use that weapon, which would give it a two-level damage buff compared to the local enemies. You could bring this weapon down to TVHM or NVHM… like I think bringing overpowered weapons in BL2 worked the same as you’re describing for BL3? I might be misunderstanding.

To get overpowered weapons in BL2, you did have to reach that level by running the gauntlet once, but once through, you opt to never touch it again. With BL3, there’s just no one-time gauntlet requirement to unlock the levels (well, I suppose eight different runs, one per level). In BL3, just like 2, you still need to fight at those higher levels to get near-level gear to drop… like I’m not getting OP8 stuff at OP3 the same way I won’t get MM10 gear at MM3. (Or am I missing something about where to get MM10 gear?)

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the difference is that , u can skip first 6 mayhem level effortlessly since the scale over there basically og m4 . then u can force urself to use m6 weapon to kill anything at m10 to get m10 weapon . in comparison bl3 progression is super short .

it will become even more obvious once they scale the loot for vending machine , fl4k can grab m10 stagcoach , moze can grab quickie effortlessly .

Well i was hoping thered be multiple different and varied digistruct peak like challenges before going up in mayhem levels.

Like digistuct peak was fun for me… Tbh my wife didnt like doing it over n over cuz she said her words. its the same sh’t but rhe bosses did change up later on.

Now they coulda done it better! Added more different varied areas. Extra weird boss runs for each level. Etc… Oh i dont know anymore.

I just feel theres no balance in the system. Tbh i took out m10 with m0 or m4 gear. I used grave warden as my test. Then me and the wife went to m6 tom.n xam farmed a few times then went back to grave m10 and other bosses.

Its co pletely different as u need only weapons in mayhem. I dont like it. Op levels felt balanced to me.

Tvhm was a diffetent game a massive inprovement in bl2 for me. Different spawns. New boss moves. New stuff.

To me this games like butterfinger. I loved the old formula all these years now its new n improved n taste like creamy garbage crap to me.

I no longer buy butterfinger… If i knew the formula was gonna be this tbh i wouldnt have bought the game.

(I didnt bee shield. Did all the weird builds… Roughnider. Healthgate tank axton tediore axton ffyl axton explosive axton my wife was orb fest team heals maya and ffyl low hp mega elemental dmg)

We jdestroyed the game n still explored different stuff to play with all the time…

This its… Well she quit im still here whining like a baby.

I did play BL2 but moved on to other things, never saw OP levels or Digistruct peak was that a late life cycle addition to BL2?

If so then I’d say it would be a bit early in the BL3 cycle to write off any chance of there being a totally badass willy-wave difficulty level somewhere down the line .

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One year from release which we will be approaching soon. With the ultimate vault hunter pack. So its a bought addonn but some ppl basically got the ultimate edition

There were 5 dlcs that stayed active for ppl to play after the addition of the peak and op levels for ppl to play.

Marcus merc missions turkeyday. Wedding massacre some other brilliant stuff.

Well still time for BL3 and given the different buisiness environment they are in at this time I’d say it could be longer before it came along.