Man I thought I was bad with my K/D ratio being more deaths than kills…then again I don’t play Monty like a take, I play him like a defender: I pick a spot and shoot from there, dodging as required. One thing I don’t want to be is surrounded or without some type of healing support.
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Lol, yeah,I played my very first live pvp match with Orendi last night (Overgrowth) and went 3-2-4. The match didnt go super long (think I used my ult like 2-3 times). I was actually pretty happy I stayed positive and didn’t overextend way too much, but I let some enemies get away with slivers of health. This is a character I never thought I would enjoy, but I’m having a blast (literally).
Montana is a great example. I see people do amazing things with Montana, yet when I’ve tried to play him, I get melted.
I think this list in particular is very much an “on paper” sort of assessment, but things play out differently in actual games.
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I have found that if I dont have a healer on my team, dont play Montana. The guy is such as bullet magnet that you just cant be productive unless there is someone nearby to help keep you above 50% hp. Sure you can get a kill here and there, but its just a night and day difference when you have a support.
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Alani’s bubble is not the best skill in the game. The statement of it being an ultimate is arguable though.
What would you consider the best (non ult) skill in the game?
After thinking about it, I have a hard time coming up with something thats better than Alani’s bubble. An AoE with a knockup, that stuns you in the air (allowing everyone easy LoS) with a helix that makes you take 30% more damage. I cant really think of anything that single handily shuts down everything caught in it, with a strong likelihood of them dieing.
I think they should nerf all three of these things but in exchange for making her claw lunge more useful for engaging targets. They should probably remove the half second delay before lunging and maybe increase its damage slightly. She’s supposed to be a melee/ranged hybrid, but I rarely see people utilizing her melee enough.
Caldarius has similar problems, but his gravitic burst is just fine. His melee damage, however, is a little low and should receive a buff; it’s already slower and harder to hit with than Melka’s melee. His gun could use a small boost as well, but I would be content with the melee buff. I suppose they should also do something about his ultimate cancelling if you touch the ceiling or a small leaf on Overgrowth.
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Yes, its the sad truth of Montana.
I’m really trying my best to think of a better skill, but I can’t. It has everything you could wish for, AoE stun that maintains you in the air for easy view and shooting with nothing blocking your bullets/proejctiles and the one in the bubble takes 30% extra damage, whoever gets in the bubble gets 30% of the damage dealt to them in splash.
Not the three, but maybe two in exhange of giving her more damage on her skills. Making Mellka actually risk herself so she can pick up a kill and think that she can thanks to the damage of the skill, therefore we will have less “Safe Mellkas” that are annoying flies and more Assasins Mellka, as (in my opinion) should be the character.
Yeah, even if you dont get the skill in full cooldown, its still 16 seconds that you need to eat as Caldy.
The thread is going places, that’s great.
Quick melee doesnt work when your on his head.
He far from a one trink pony i think people just arent good with him apart from the ult and so justify a op 100 to 0 ult by saying he is bad.
He has the best life steal in the game you can regen your health by attacking a minion wave. His melee spin makes him a good wave clearer without the need for skills i also see people say his kills lack damage when well they really dont.
With melka i feel people doont understand the character her melee skill and quick melee damage depends her the target being poisened less the time poisoned but more damage less time with poisoned doesnt make her less powerful just makes her melee less strong with no one uses anyway.
She is quite slow and her claw lunge has less distnace the cals yet hers needs to be toned down?
Also thorn has a bleed effect that lasts for 8 seconds it be rather silly for thorn to have a better damage over time effect than melka.
Why do tier A character needs to be brought down?
I mean normally with nerf its easier to bring one down than 25 up but when 6 are tier A in your list and more would be up there i think if your spent more time with the character eg kleese, reyna, el dra, montana, S&A ORENDI I mean if your missing with the shawdow pillar (i dont know how) thats not the character being less that other thats your not being as good with them.
Perhaps you could make a list of characters a particular hero can counter and perform better against. After going through all of the characters this way, you could connect the dots and determine theoretical “best” team comps.
Edit: It’s kinda like Pokemon. Your fire type counters my grass type, so I need something to counter fire.
Ok, so not to sound like i’m arguing against the thread, but this is a sure example of why it’s impossible to Tier the characters. And like a lot of us agree, one player may be awesome (like some top CoD players) and others may be clueless to life…literally 
Exhibit A: Notice on team A that Orendi is 14-1 and on Team B she is 3-11. Also interesting to look at the loadouts, because the better Orendi player didn’t have more damage items!!
The other outstanding issue here is that I got 5 kills with WF haha!
Case closed, the court will adjourn after going to the pub 
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Marquis only has 2 issues… the first is his speed debuff and buff… giving him this option makes him have too much es capability… As a sniper if he gets caught, he should be dead, or only get away if the other team messes up… especially with a melee character.
Instead he throws down his bubble has the 2 or 3 owls circling around him attack the person and then runs away at super speed.
the second issue with him is the fact his HP is too high, he’s a sniper, as I said above, if he gets caught he should be dead…
His dmg is fine, snipers are supposed to be high risk/high reward…
Kleese is like F tier, his hit box is huge, he’s ultra squishy, and
This thread is based on the assumption (or at least I hope it is) that every character is being played by a person with great skill. However, the only ways to truly come up with a tier list is by doing what I suggested in an above post and then play testing or by competing in a few tournaments and gathering hard data.
No its not its based on opinions.
While his hitbox is huge, his tazer does very high damage, and if you let him sit around 3-4 of his rifts, he is basically unkillable. (4 rifts is what, 600 shield every 2 seconds?)
His heal at level 5 is great, he gets a decent slow at level 2 (maybe its 3 i dont recall), wave clears easily with rifts, can avoid melee with his levitating chair, and his ult is great for setting up combos with other teammates.
He has a giant hitbox with a low hp pool (large shield though) which balances him out. Solid B Tier character
I Agree with most of your Tier Lists except for a few changes.
A Montana
Montana is A Tier Since you compared him to “Tank” Characters he outclasses Kelvin,Attikus and Boldur in every aspect of the game and on a different playing field than those 3. He dishes out damage and can Tank the other 3… either have one not both.
F Tier Toby,Attikus and Whiskey The worst 3 characters in the game out of the 26 current Battleborn don’t need to explain that.
C Tier Benedict - While he can be annoying flying away it’s not extremely difficult to hit him in air. The damage he does with rockets are fair but not the easiet to hit either with reload spead or faster rocket helix choice. His Ult is good as well but personally feel he should get some more health. He is good for minion clearing other than that he’s not really a huge threat.
A Tier Shayne and Aurox, good damage especially when you can get shield helix. The invisible skill is really good and she has a boomerang. Top Ten Character IMO doesn’t have any serious flaws.
A Tier Orendi “Glass” Character does really good damage on all of her abilities and has good sprint speed. The Helix where she can recharge either 3 abilities really gets her going. Health is an issue for her but can really hit hard.
A Tier - Rath Ultimate is really good so is his knockup. Top 5 Melee character.
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Of course it is. NeloD said so him/herself. What NeloD said and what I said do not have to be mutually exclusive. Like I said, it is based on the assumption.
This is right. Therefore showcasing screenshots is pointless. I can go to my match story and show the last matches with Benedict since he’s my most played character where I get an average of 20 kills per match, in many of them above 30.
Then I can pick up someone that started playing Benedict and go 0 / 14 before ragequitting. That’s not pointing the character, that’s pointing the player and its experience with the character.
The assumption is made around the same skill level of play, hell I got reported more than once for “aim botting” with Marquis with a 53% aim success (or so the match showed). That is just the perception of the opponent team, maybe because they’re not used to average Marquis (or good ones) or because they need to blame something and they can’t blame their lack of skill on that one match.
In short, characters are tools, the player is what matters, but Tier list differentiates between a tool that is a stick and a tool that is a shotgun. One is superior than the other, however if you don’t know how to use the shotgun, the guy with a stick will beat you up.
Exactly. Kleese is as good as he can get. He doesn’t need nerfs neither buffs in my opinion.
Meanwhile your reasoning is true this is not the case for a mere absurd thing that Montana has. He seems to have a secret passive that makes him a magnet to bullets and projectiles, everyshot that is a missed shot ends up in Montana, even the ones from allies, he saves more enemies than kill thanks to this and he bodyblocks to death many allies giving no vision to noone (or he just gets bodyblocked by a wild minion that is hard for him to see). It is REALLY rare to see him full HP ready to initiate, and when he does so, his CC is so underwhelming (because he can’t deal damage while knocking people up except the basic dash stun), all characters can retreat and not die against Montana and thus requiring someone else with Montana.
Because of how big and obvious Montana is, everyone can think that he wants to stun and thus avoid having a bad position against Montana, what’s more, noone engages Montana neither they want to. He’s a presence that people are scared of, however, he is so slow and big that he’s harassed 24/7 and the one who gets scarred away is him, not anyone else. This is really sad, but its why Montana is C.
Meanwhile Attikus and WF are arguably the worst, Toby doesn’t feel like that. Toby still has a nice charged M1 that can deal a big amount of DPS, stuns and clear waves with ease. His only weakness are his big hitbox, low HP pool and bad ultimate. He’s ok.
He is indeed a huge threat when he appears without you noticing, he melts anything, even tanks, with ease. He is balanced around “Spot me first and kill me” with the lowest HP pool in the entire game. His inmense damage, mobility and utility makes him B tier, he can 1v1 any assasin and win as long as he doesnt get stunned. He’s trash before Lv3 though.
She falls off greatly later in the game, having nearly no damage. She’s a tank that can gank, great utility and mobility, but she lacks damage later on the game making her B tier. If she had more damage, she’d be A tier.
I do believe Orendi is almost A Tier. I enjoy playing with her and ranking up kills like it’s nothing with so many pillars and CD reductions with nullify that it’s almost a joke. However, her early sucks and can be HARD denied to reach mid-late thanks to that. She’s an easy target due to her big head hitbox. She has a good wave clearing but she’s not good at pushing, she’s the nukiest of all characters and excels at that, however, she doesn’t excel in anything more, so she can’t be above B Tier. She’s balanced
Note: Incursion is a game mode that lets characters with a bad early stay back and get EXP with no danger whatsoever, making it a paradise for late bloomers and it’s the game mode most played. You have to pay attention taht the other two game modes there’s no sentry neither a one lane with 5 players that can defend you, and thus make late bloomers work for it, that in my opinion is more balanced, but that’s another matter about game modes.
How polite, last time I checked I was a normal man, so “him” will do.
Toby is the bottom 3 Battleborn. Nobody else even comes close to that. I played the game since Launch and he is one the worst characters.
Orendi does not have a big hitbox and does really good damage. No idea why you say her hitbox is a downfall when its not. She is small and good sprint speed.
Benedict is annoying sure but again he isn’t a big threat with hard to hit rockets.
Montana is the best “Tank” Character. If you think characters like Reyna and Phoebe are better than him you should change your tier list. Kleese is not better than Montana, neither Reyna and Ghalt, El Dragon, Phoebe as well.
Shayne and Aurox is A tier. They do good damage if you compare them to the top Melee characters, Rath and Galilea. They don’t fall short to both of them. Galilea is still the top.
But you haven’t given me proper arguments. His DPS is insane, his wave clearing is insane with pierce, his big projectile hitbox make him an easy sniper mode, he has dashes, a stun of two seconds, shield to cover friends/himself that gives him also with Helix upgrades 3 shots that can pierce with added damage. He’s damn good, his only weakness are his hitbox, slow movement speed (but he still has dashes) and a bad ultimate.
She’s small, therefore when you try to aim at her you’ll get crits because her head is as big as half of her hitbox almost, making it really easy to crit, hell it’s at melee’s range to crit without needing to aim too. She’s squishy and goes down even faster thanks to an easy and accessible crit hitbox.
But that’s where you’re wrong, his rockets are not hard to hit, he even has seeking rockets with increased damage, he even throws three rockets to activate the seeking. If you’re not confident with your aim, thanks to his mobility he can hug any character and throw three rockets at their feet and I assure you that one at least will hit.
But Montana is a worse character in general than those. The characters has been previously discussed as to why they are X tier, and those are superior to Montana no contest. Surprisingly enough even if he has a big HP pool, Reyna has more survivality due to her smaller hitbox and overshield with heal (also her ultimate), Phoebe has an incredible DPS with a jump/teleport to get in/away also silence for free, Ghalt has two CCs that combo into each other with incredible DPS thanks to the easy access of crits with a shotgun while getting someone into a scraptrap (reminder that he melts in INcursion a Merc camp in three seconds), El Dragón has way more mobility damage and a more reliable stun and knock up.
Rath and Galilea have by FAR way more damage than Shayne and in fact Galilea has more utilities than S&A. Rath main damage comes from skills, not his M1.
But what benefit is that for the game as a whole? We already have so many glass cannon characters (Orendi, Thorn, El Dragon, Phoebe, Marquis, Rath…) Why take one of the few exceptions to the rule - an evasive, durable skirmisher like Mellka - just to give the game yet another squishy damage-dealer? For those of us who play Mellka for her unique playstyle, that would leave us only with, what… Caldarius?
Again, I think Mellka is fine. I play her a skirmisher, and yes, I will do my best to frustrate you and then fly away when you think you’ve got me. When I hit L8, I’ll switch roles and start hunting for your head, and yes, I will probably taunt you when I get it (and I will!) But I also play other characters, and whenever I come up against Mellka doing the same to me, I love seeing it.
Mel suits her current role: she’s nimble, aggressive, abrasive, rough and tumble, an adrenaline-junkie. She doesn’t carry teams, she’s not frequently played even today, she’s not a hard counter to anyone but also has no hard counters… one of the most independent, self-sufficient, don’t-mess-with-this characters in the game.
edit: Also, I get that you’re not suggesting major changes to the character - just tweaks - but it’s the rationale I’m questioning: this idea that Mellka is being played wrongly somehow, and that she needs adjustments so people play her as she “should be.” I think how she’s played now is just right. Adjust her in that framework, maybe, but the framework itself doesn’t need to be changed…