#41

Cool, in test it wasn’t very useful anyway on low or mid RU starts. I’ll know now to just delay starting it for 40 seconds or so.

BTW, THANKS FOR TGE IN GAME TIMER!!! If that was a bug, leave it please.

#43

Yup - totally a bug, hence why we also added a UI option setting for it - and if you click it with a ‘no rush’ enabled map, it counts down. All bugs. Terrible, heart wrenching bugs.

12 Likes
#44

Are you getting the ions cannons back into the research line to reach destroyers? I would love to see them back to the research requirement for destroyers

#45

Do you love it enough to get destroyers a full minute later than a HW2 race?

Legit question.

#46

It doesn’t have to be that black and white.

First thing to consider here though is that the Hig ability to tech straight to destroyers should yield them faster destroyers than Ku/Tii. The HW races essentially get assault frigates for free if rushing to destroyers. This is one of the fundemental asymmetric balance points of the game and is as it should be in my opinion.

Second thing to consider is two fold. Ion Frigs are currently almost a pointless tech due to being able to jump straight destroyers and how much better destroyers are to Ions. This issue could be resolved by reducing both the Ion cannon research time and the super cap drive research time so that Ions can come out fast enough to be viable and destroyers still come out reasonable. This would also improve the issue of Carriers not being as viable if you are able to skip Ion to research Super drive at a reduced research time. If you want destroyers or HCs then you much research Ions.

Second thing is lore quality. I’m for good balance as much as anyone else, but it shouldn’t be at the exspense of lore quality if it can be easily avoided. Destroyers have ion cannons. You should not be able to build them or HCs if you have not research Ion Cannons.

So to summarize fix lore, pointless Ions, and too long to get carriers in one swoop by reducing time for Ion Cannon research and super cap drive research by the total current amount of Ion Cannon research.

Ion = cap drive + cap chassis + Ion Cannon (reduced)
Destroyer = Cap Drive + cap chassis + Ion Cannon (reduced) + super cap drive (reduced)
Carrier = cap drive + cap chassis + super cap drive (reduced) + super cap chassis
Missile destroyer = cap drive + cap chassis + super cap drive (reduced) + guilded missiles
HC = cap drive + cap chassis + Ion cannons (reduced) + super cap drive (reduced) + super cap chassis + heavy guns.

#47

I presume that you are taking about +1 minute considering your chart, cuz right now it would take +2 minutes.
Yeah, I have no problem with +1 minute on reaching a destroyer, it is kinda balanced, since you can build more firepower that way, the biggest draw back is the +1000ru cost to reach the destroyer, that cost kinda hurt to reach it, it would be necessary a decrease on either the ion or the destroyer research cost.
Would like to hear a few hw1 fellows on that one.

1 Like
#48

Yes, I forgot to say reduce the cost of Ion research and Super Cap Dive research accordingly also.

#49

It’s 240s/4800ru to build a Hiigaran Destroyer and 280s/4700ru to build a Kushan Destroyer. With Ions it would be 340s (~10 second wiggle room) and 5700u (~200ru wiggle here). So 330s/5500ru.

Ion is 1k (super flexible on that) and SuperCap is also 1k. SuperChass is 1500 (some flexibility there but Heavyguns would have to go up).

#50

So ion research is 60 seconds and super cap is 80 seconds.

Reduce ion to 40 seconds and super cap to 40 seconds. To leave the destroyer the same, or even add 10 seconds (maybe to ions) to add a little time considering now I get 2 frigate types while on the way to destroyers.

Reduce cost of each to 500 ru. Or make them both 600 ru.

Why would we need an increase on heavy guns if we fully compensate the reduced time for the added Ion requirement? Remember Ion should be a prerequisite for HC also.

Edit: re read, you were suggesting toning down super chassis to get carriers out faster? Faster carriers is why I suggest pulling a larger percent from super drive.

1 Like
#51

An additional update is rolling out this afternoon:

[quote]

  • Resolved UI display lag issue seen most severely in Research menu[/quote]
10 Likes
#52

Humm, idk, to be honest some field test would be necessary since we are getting balance changes, in the today scenario 330/5500 looks kinda a little high on rus, but not much, just a little.
Well anyway, still would be really happy to see ions back, cuz they are completely forgettable now, of course gonna need a little tweaking, according with the balance, but that is part of the deal.

#53

I have carriers at Superdrive, actually. Your numbers look good though but you’ll have to live with capdrive and capchassis being slightly more expensive timewise than superdrive/chassis.

Shakes out like this:

capdrive  capchassis  ionfrig |  superdrive  superchasis
800         900       600     |  1000        1000
60          50        40      |  40          60

(I hope that formats correctly)

which puts the carrier at 200s/3200ru vs Hiigaran 75s/1800ru and Kushan Destroyer at 300s/4800ru.

(sorry, I got distracted-we’re hunting down a terrible bug with frigates guarding things)

edit: forgot to mention, that looks pretty good to me. You?

2 Likes
#54

That is awesome. Although that carrier is fast! Way fast. We’ll have to see how this shakes out, but spinning up a 5th/6th production line that fast could really give the HW2 guys a headache. If I go full bore harvesting early on to have the RU capacity to support anything from 6 production lines when my first carrier drops (inti/light vet, inti/assault) that could be a massive show of force pretty quickly.

#55

That’s a lot of investment, though. Leaves you a good chunk more defenseless than usual. But the carrier does absolutely need to be available more quickly. As we know, most games with Homeworld races you only have your 1 mothership and your 1 carrier. How nice it would be to more easily get a second carrier.

I think reducing the times mentioned above help greatly.

(And again, thank you guys for the Support Frigate/Repair Corvette fixes. They will make a permanent impact)

#56

Looks good =)

1 Like
#57

So just to make sure we have all the bases covered, super drive unlocks after cap chassis, however finishing it does not give you destroyer.

From there you get carrier without super cap chassis? What will the new icon be for super cap chassis?

We will also be able to research guilded missiles after super cap drive and get missile destroyers without first researching Ion Drive correct? This will give us missile destroyers a little faster then we currently get them if that is OK, or you could increase guided missile research time to make it the same.

#58

Actually wait. Cap drive :60? Down from 1:25? Cap chassis :50? Down from 1:55? Am I reading this wrong?

#59

Great update GearBOX!

Thank you for the update guys. I wanted to report in about a bug that I think has been around for a while now. This bug is for HW1 salvage corvettes. I just got done playing a ffa game and I wanted to try to use salvage corvettes tactics. When I managed to capture 2 destroyers my mother ship was about half way the map called Radial Semetry. After capturing my opponents destroyers with my salvage corvettes latched on, I decided to hyper my mother ship closer to where they had captured the destroyer. Then I discovered that it seems after hypering my mothership, HW1 salvage corvettes would not try to attempt to dock the salvaged destroyers to my mothership. They completely ignored my mother ship as if they did not know my mother ship was there. I had to set the current attached salvage corvettes off and reattach them back to the destroyers in order for my salvagers to be able to relocate where my mother ship is. After reattachment they managed to reroute course heading towards the mothership.

I don’t know if you guys had already reported this since there’s so many post to read I just wanted to bring it to you guys attention.

Thanks for the time and excellent work on the patch.

1 Like
#60

Correct. Cap chassis -> Superdrive (unlocks Carrier)

Let’s just get this up and running before we sweat that.

Missile destroyers are untouched at the moment as I just haven’t gotten to it yet. Let’s do that.

No I copied it over wrong, it’s 100/100 since there has to be a bit of a barrier there before you can start chucking hyperspace capable frigates across the map. Also I don’t want Assault Frigates to suck.

#61

Cool. I like everything then. Speaking of assault frigates sucking :slight_smile: are you planning on changing the attack profile to allow the plasma bomb to target vettes? It was this way in HW1 and probably making a significant difference in what we’re seeing with regards to how ineffective the anti vette frigate is vs vettes. I don’t know for sure, but we assume that is why assault frigates are not turning to face vettes when they attack them. They just sit in place and use whatever projectile weapon can target them.