I main ACOG Whiskey Foxtrot. WF may not have quite the range control that Marquis has, but his burst damage is insane.
If there was an acheivement for making Montana, ISIC, and Atticus run away with sh*t in their pants, I’d have gotten it already.
Why I think Rath’s ult shouldn’t be nerfed is because you can use the off hand melee and it pushes him back far enough where he wastes a quarter of his ult and even as characters with low health it wont kill if you just start using the melee to keep him away. This is just what I do and it has been working well.
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You guys know that using any shield pen massively reduces Gal’s dps right?
I main Marqui, not gal, so I’m not “defending cus I like it.”
If you can deal damage through a shield you take away her extra damage. She is extremely vulnerable to this.
I am, in general opposed to quick nerfs or buffs. I think that right now the average player is not experienced enough to know all available counters.
Gal + Miko is not that hard to counter. Run shield pen and pressure the miko (hit gal to take away bonus damage then try to push or kill miko). Miko is one of the easiest characters to kill from tame who isn’t a tank due to his massive head. Gal+ any other support is easier to counter since only miko can really put heal shield pen damage.
That said, Gal’s tool kit is very comprehensive. Rather than removing entire aspects of it, how about tuning them down slightly: Stun reduced to 1.5 seconds, Pull range reduced by 25%, make silence and slow mutually exclusive.
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I agree I usually dont like quick nerfs or buffs either but Galilea is a different story, her entire kit is way to good. And she needs to get hard nerfed. lowering her little by little will work after a long time but how it looks right now is the community doesn’t want to wait everyone except the galilea players want her nerfed hard because again as it stands she is significantly better then every character in the game.
I have to disagree. We are seeing a young community whose collective understanding of the game is low. As the game ages more people will understand how to counter various strats.
The game should be balanced on character potential not current player competency.
Yes, gal is strong. But so is Rath on his terms. An accurate Marqui can easily maintain a huge k/d and ka/d (Mine is currently over 7 and 10 respectively) and dominate games. Atticus well played will end your day. Galt can cherry pick murder any support (including the miko escorting a gal) almost at will. A decent thorn is nearly unkillable without her making a big mistake.
Slightly down tuning gal + allowing the community time to further master the game is a much better solution than destroying a unique character.
The only truly OP thing in the game is team work. People are seeing miko + gal teams working together in unison and getting wrecked trying to face them 1v2. There are plenty of two character teams that can neuter gal / miko but they are currently under utilized.
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So had an experience tonight against an aimbotting Marquis, sometimes they make it very obvious. Aimbotting definitely gave him a big advantage, perfect accuracy and whatnot, but he was still a bad player, which is why he had a negative K/D and his team lost. We also kinda picked on him for cheating.
So it was basically like facing a Galilea.
That could have been me 
D but jeah phoebe shouldnt be buffed and shouldnt have aoe just because rath has it… she isnt rath she is phoebe the only melee class that requires good aiming and if played well she is a beast like really you rek ■■■■ up…I love playing with her and I love the fact that she requires practice at first please dont buff her and make her op…
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“The only melee class that requires good aiming” pfft. Boldur says hi. I randomed her once and it was VERY easy in comparison x.x went 10:0 just left clicking things
I do main Galilea pauses for hissing and jeering, now that’s out of the way.
She is not hard to counter.
I have played with her extensivly (masterd her in the beta and 5 Ambra kills from mastering her again) so I know what she does and how she uses it. This translates into me playing ring-a-ring-a-roses around her with thorn keeping her in my blight and throwing volly’s and giggling bc I can jump straight over her head and even when she pulls me I take one hit and GO miss Azomozeus you still can’t kill me. I’ve made Galilea chase me for ever taking her off my team. Orendi’s just need to bait her in to taking an SF pillar… oh and like you said shield pen is her worst nightmare.
Experience translates differently for a variety of people, some people can play oscar mike for weeks and still miss noob tubes and ults and some people can use him for a few hours and get nothing but headshots with or without scope and easily hit his ults and noob tube. This goes for anyone using any character, sure saying experience sounds fancy but it doesn’t really translate into much. I agree some people may be lowly experienced, but there are people who have put tons of hours into this game already and are by no means inexperienced at the game and the small roster of characters.
We arent’t really speaking probability here or advanced tactics so saying someone who is extremely strong shouldn’t be nerfed because in the future someone may find some niche to counter them isn’t a strong statement. It reminds me of league when they left Riven, lee, ahri , and lux as tier gods saying… yea they will be dealt with eventually- but they weren’t they had to be on the development side toned down. Everything when a game releases isn’t going to be fair, so there is no real point in sitting on your hands about it.
But i do agree quickfixes and patches should be avoided, the goal should be taking a big look of why is this character too strong, what would make them better, and how does that effect the rest of the character pool. sometimes Nerfing one character gives way as a buff to several others and vice versa.
Exactly. I run her in circles kiting her into slow bubbles and owls as Marquis. People still just stand in her desecrate and try to go toe to toe with her in it and expect to win. If you stand in her desecrate, you are going to have a bad time. She’s classified as territorial for a reason.
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I don’t think that’s so simple.
I was a bit surprised that Gali was not among the first heroes to be balanced on 3rd of May hot fix. As I thought she needed to be changed much more than for example Ambra. Which was quite ok after mid-open-beta balancing. Although all that being said, the change GBX made to Ambra gave me a lot of trust in them. As even if that nerf seemed harsh to me in the beginning - it made character better: much harder to use, but still strong, just that you have to be in much closer (melee) range to be viable. Or you can look at her like much riskier to play but at the same time as rewarding if not more if played right. She became much closer to what she was in CTT (minus cooldown gear stacking 1s delay sunspots 
).
And that might be the reason for Ambra being changed in hot fix and Gali - not. Ambra has come through a lot of iterations and was tested: CTT, early access, open beta. She was changed, but the general set up was quite ok with her. She just needed a minor tweaking, to put her in correct place. Gali on the other hand…she would be a perfect character for Borderlands 3 for example, as in single player game. She starts strong and as you level, she gets all those nice abilities, not actually loosing much from unchoosen options. And that does not really work well in pvp game. Her dps from basic attacks in later stages of the match is much higher than most ultimates in the game (only Rath’s ult can rival it), she has stun (which we can argue till end of times if that’s needed or not for tank/dps char) and her Desecrate can achieve almost all buff’s and cc’s in game at the same time. So changing her is not just “reduce damage by x%”, “increase skill Y cooldown by z seconds”, etc. She needs quite a rethinking of skills and or helix upgrade options, looking in all the ways you could stack damage increase (corruption is another level that most other heroes don’t have that skews her damage potential) to make her more fitting to game. And that takes much more time than current simple fixes we saw already.
For example there is this thread on these forums that provides a suggestion on how to change helix:
http://forums.gearboxsoftware.com/t/galiea-loses-weaknesses-as-her-rank-is-leveled-out-of-match-fix-her-tree/1399184
I don’t agree completely with all the levels, but the general idea is good - reshuffle the helix options that they would actually be a trade-off choices. But that requires a lot of testing, not to break a character into completely unusable. But after Ambra change, I believe GBX is capable of managing that…just that i will take some time.
I would have wanted for her to be changed even before release…but no game with many characters are easy to balance. And this should especially be hard for GBX (i’m just guessing here), since they did not do such a big rooster before in a competitive pvp setting. And it looks like they don’t want to rush and make bad balancing choices. That’s good, even if frustrating for the moment.
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hahaha, I do this to him ALL the time, it’s hilarious! A lot of people don’t use their off-hand and it can help out a ton.
I also use it to push people off their sniper ledge down into middle
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HFirst of all I would like to thank gearbox for making a game that I look forward to playing every day since the release its been a while something sucked me in this good . Now I’ve been reading all the complaints about certain characters especially Galilea and I only have one thing to say : know your role ! Besides Baldur she’s the only Tanky character in the game because doing it with Isic is almost impossible and he’s much more effective on the higher platforms unleashing hell. I think most people are impatient with her after using her for a lot of games I figured out not only her strengths but her weaknesses. First though let us remember this is not halo or overwatch or some other mindless game when you play incursion you’re not playing for the player kills which so many people seem to focus on, your main objective is to push your line of minions to destroy the sentry bot not runing around chasing people . Having said that you need characters that can push the line I forgot to mention Kalvin before if a person knows what they’re doing he can tank out due to the health gain with chomp. You’re not suppose to solo Galilea and this is where people get frustrated with, this is why you have rogue and range characters a skilled Shayne or Deande can stealth up behind Galilea through the tunnel cc her while a Montana or Isic is gonna unload its not that hard to take a Galilea down, patience is the key watch her throw if she misses her shield throw she’s ripe for a quick kill. I was running with Benedict while my friend was Kalvin and everytime we encountered a Galilea on the opposite team we totally controlled her. People get frustrated because they try to run in with rath or phoebe and solo her inside her own desecrate field and then they complain that they get dropped well DUH . Just use your damn brains people and stop complaining battleborn as a whole is one of the most balanced games I ever played I honestly think marquis being able to hit the sentry bot from his own teams platform is way bigger of an issue than anything about Galilea. I don’t think she’s overpowered also because her regular attack does more damage than any other skill (I guess depending how you augment the shield throw I usually go for the wounding) and her desecrate amplifies that damage with a little dot on top ( anyone who chooses damage increase over slow/silence is a noob) so basically if you read her skill list you should know that maybe besides Baldur and Kalvin you should never 1v1 melee her yet still so many people just charge at me and get crushed and then complain. There is many ways to effectively shut her down and trust me she won’t feel like she’s overpowered just use your damn brain cells !!!
Have to agree. Gal is great against teams who don’t play together, but then most of the BB are. As soon as you are against a 1/2 competent group they will punish you if you step out of your territory as Gal. Ive even come across quite a few builds that easily kill Gal in 1v1, most notably Ambra with high move speed and CC reduction gear.
People need to stop with the “nerf X hero” mentality. Nerfing X hero has never fixed anything. It just makes another hero “OP”, which then leads to nerf the new “OP” Hero.
As many have said Gal can be easily killed, just because the hero you want to use cant easily kill her doesn’t make her OP or any other Hero OP. Nerfing hero’s hurts them in PVE and sometimes render the hero unplayable in PVP. Think about this before wanting to nerf a hero because you crushed or were crushed in a PVP match where 90% of the time People aren’t working together, and don’t know what they are doing. Any hero that gets snowballed(leveled faster than your team) will crush you. A snowballed rath will crush an entire team with just his ult.
My suggestion as players is to learn every hero and their match ups because someone always trumps someone else. Learn Team Work and map objectives.
My suggestion to the developers is to stop nerfing Heros. If a hero is underperforming, then buff that hero. Don’t break a heros kit because people have issues with it in one mode of the game.
Imagine trying to tank PVE advanced mode with a nerfed Gal. She needs her kit to survive just like every other hero.
I highly disagree with nerfing Miko’s healing. I have played Miko A LOT. The one I have been healing succesfully has died a lot too. If Miko starts healing less than they do, then Miko is going to be pretty bad at the thing Miko is supossed to do.
Ambra is not a full healer anyways.
I mean, Ambra can do a lot of damage but Miko isn’t anywhere NEAR that. For this, Miko is underpowered, and Ambra underpowered.
No.
Miko can’t even heal that much, except for when Miko is using a skill. If Miko just uses the healing beam, everyone can outdamage this. If you can get between Miko and the partner, and start targeting Miko… It’s over.
I do not agree for a few reasons. I’m going to start with something that should be fixed in the first place. The healing beam is so annoyingly hard to use sometimes. Having to press the button 5 times before the healing beam actually starts working sucks.
If my partner is full health, and a rath is getting close, I want to use my healing beam on that person already so I am sure that the healing beam is not going to ■■■■ up when I try to use it in battle.
The healing beam is not extra usefull or anything, while targeting someone with full health so… Why does it really matter that Miko can ‘heal’ someone with full health?
I especially don’t get why I should be forced out of my healing beam after 5 seconds or so. How the heck am I going to help my teammates by doing this? A battle takes quite some time, and if an enemy is attacking my buddy, I want to keep my buddy alive. Miko WON’T be able to do that if the healing beam just stops. I’m a healer, please let me do my ■■■■■■■ job.
Good thing support stations can heal you up while you are in battle! Because they totally can!
Miko is usefull because they can come with you to a battle, and keep you alive while battling.
You sound like you want Miko to be a portable support station. A thing that breaks extremely easily and barely heals you up. Miko is supposed to keep you alive in battle.
I do think Miko has some things that need to be balanced. Maybe tone down it’s attack damage.(But I don’t really think it’s OP) and get rid of the helix that makes them 30% faster while being attacked. That’s ridiculous.
Okay, Montana=tank. I am fine with the damage he does, because his health is so ridiculous.
It’s so easy to quick melee a Rath, and escape. Rath’s ult is fine.
Phoebe can be quite tanky, if you choose the right helix. She can get 30% damage reduction for 3 seconds after using TS. That’s very usefull. I’ve played quite some games as Phoebe now, and I feel like she dies a lot less easy than Rath.
Let me agree with everything you said.
Oh one thing I want to add. There are loads of replies to this topic, but I had no time to read them at all. Everything I said is based on the first thingy.
I think shes kinda broken in both PVE and PVP
My first ever PVE match with her I had over 100 kills over the next best on my team and over double the most damage done than next best and I wasn’t running ahead I was playing with the group.
Most games with those same teammates with other characters I’ve played a lot and i’m really good with I’m on the top of those stats but usually by around 10-20% ahead, not 100%+.
Gearbox is going to bring some people down and others up, if you keep buffing everyone to the top you get a power creep that ruins the experience of the game.
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Don’t know what you are smoking but I want some
Your suggestions for Miko are outrageous it would totally break the character and render him useless
I don’t know how you played Phoebe either claiming she has no dps … Again I don’t know where you get your stuff from but it must be a brain basher
And now when it comes to rath first of all let me be clear I hate him absolutely hate him buuuuuuuut I think he’s a proper character and as annoying and powerful his ult is there is way to read him and stop him a well timed stun can screw his whole combo. Another thing is know your characters know who can take rath on and when to run
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Ummm, no. The healing beam is not an ability, it’s the secondary attack. And his beam healing himself is a helix node. I’ve used it and it’s an incredibly lackluster heal. Miko is better off relying on Biosythesis to heal while taking the node that allows him to heal nearby allies with Biosynthesis. And if you’re having trouble with the slow, stay out of his range. Miko can’t throw that skill exceptionally far.
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