White Elephant Unforgiven Melee Amara - lvl 60 mh10

Gameplay video uploaded

So the build isn’t showing up. It just sends me to the character page on the website.

The skill tree page was taken down recently.

Is there another page where I can see the build? I get the jist of it but I don’t want to make any silly mistakes.

Yeh the builds are down, I listed every point separately


Does [Guide] Forceful Expression, Infusion and Sustainment - Details and Math change something on your build?

Specially skill points on infusion?

No, the facepuncher does non elemental damage without it so infusion is worth it. You can go anima but DoTs are really not our thing, steady hands could also help tighten the spread of the facepuncher.

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Crit swapping feels like such a cheesy strategy. But to each their own I guess.

You can always opt for a plant based diet if cheese bothers you

lol good one
But I still think that an exploit should not be at the core of the “build”. It should be called for what it is. An exploit.

It’s not an exploit. It was part of Borderlands 2 with the lady fist (which gave 800% crit damage), it’s very much a planned item interaction.

I remember I used to shoot DPUH and swap to the gun that heals you when dealing elemental damage when soloing Terra. At the time explosive dmg counted as elemental I guess.
Thing is, just because this is in the game I dont think you should consider it a non exploit. The issue here is probably the fact that all the calculations happen when the shot lands/triggers as opposed to the moment you click the fire button. I think thats just something they could not remove from the game. So when you use a slow projectile weapon, or in this case grenades that trigger after a certain time, to then switch to a different weapon to get the modifiers from that weapon, thats just a pure exploit to me. Too bad they didnt find a way to remove this from their game.
But as you said, it can give people who usually play solo (like me) a chance at raid bosses which otherwise they wouldn’t be able to do.

I 100% guarantee they would have found a way to remove it from the game if that was what they wanted. It’s Borderlands not a competitive pvp game, you’re supposed to be finding ways to break the game, that’s 90% of the fun for a lot of players.

I would like to add that the build is still insanely powerful without the use of swapping to get the crit bonus. I rarely swap to the Unforgiven unless I’m actually using it as my melee weapon.

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I think it might have something to do with the calculations the game has to do. Instead of wasting resources and calculating the damage every time you fire a bullet it only does so when the bullet/projectile/explosion actually lands. But I might be wrong.

It’s not something that would require any resources to fix. For one, you can just not include any weapons that massively increase critical strike damage like the unforgiven, or slow moving projectiles that can crit. Or you can make those projectiles unable to benefit from crit bonuses (like Moze’s crit grenades). Even changing the unforgiven bonus to ‘increase jakobs critical damage by 432%’ instead of a general crit boost would probably kill those interactions. The reason it’s still in the game is because they want it to be in the game.

Come on man… You can use this technique if you want to, but dont say that the game developers want us to have this. In no way crit swapping is a legitimate and intended mechanic in this game, because its not. Applying modifiers from one gun to another only because its projectile hasnt landed yet? No my friend, thats just a limitation/mistake in the game code. Why not give all slow projectile weapons 400% crit right out the gate?
As I said, use this exploit if you want, just dont claim that this is inteded game design. Its either a

  1. Mistake
  2. Not fixable due to games engine/coding or whatnot (im not knowledgeable in this stuff)
  3. Large oversight on developers behalf
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Ahah ok whatever, it’s a totally unintended exploit that is present in the past 2 Borderlands games and developers could not possibly fix even after 7 years developing BL3… Cuz OMG that would be just TOO hard… How could they possibly fix that? lol. If you don’t like strong item synergies, you are probably playing the wrong game.


Sometimes things like snapshotting bonuses aren’t possible or quite hard to fix due to engine limitations. For the same reason they weren’t able to fix overlapping hitboxes that made insane B0re actions in BL2 possible. If they’d try to change/fix the snapshotting of crit bonuses it’s quite likely that multiple other systems/mechanics will be affected, might break and would require a whole rework, if possible at all.
I’ve seen these things happening multiple times while I was working on Indie projects (and even a smaller professional studio) myself. Sometimes it’s better to leave a minor undesired/unintended behaviour the way it is than potentially breaking a lot of other things. The latter has a high chance of costing a lot of additional time and money and making players angry.

I have no problem with people using this “mechanic”, though, as long as they keep it away from coop.

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Personally I think that if they wanted to get rid of it, they would have. Just like bore isn’t a feature in Bl3, crit swapping still is for a reason. Heck even bore could have been fixed in bl2 by making the damage decrease for every hitbox hit instead of exponentially increase. The craziness is part of the borderlands franchise. Adding weapons like the unforgiven with 432 crit damage is specifically in order to allow players to crit swap. Now if you don’t like that style of gameplay in coop, no one forces you to play with someone using it, and I can see how one-shotting a boss in a session of 4 players can be unfun for the rest. But crit swapping falls into the category of playing BL3 as intended, it cannot be considered an exploit.