Why can't we see what characters the other team is picking?

Battleborn Open Beta Open Beta General Discussion/Feedback
#38

Why is that? The, pro-this-idea, users on this forum have compared it to “Draft Pick” template and stated this is a good mode for advanced players (why not make this mode ranked while we’re at it). For this game to transition from casual play to hardcore play a mode like this is necessary.

I’m going to reiterate this one last time…THIS WILL NOT TAKE OVER THE DEFAULT “INCURSION” MODE YOU PLAYED IN THE BETA, IT WILL BE SEPARATE!

Since words have a different minds-eye visual representation, on a per person basis, here is a screenshot of the menu:

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If you chose “Versus Public” you would have two selections (at least what we can tell from the beta) Incursion & Meltdown, correct? So, everyone is on the same page right? If a “Draft Pick” mode is added it would not interfere with those modes. It would have it’s own selection, a 3rd choice (this mode be ranked would be nice too), title something like “Ranked - Incursion” or “Incursion - Blind Pick” (w/e, you get the point). I would argue Incursion ONLY as I don’t think Meltdown is the more competitive of the two…

It may or may not be. Would adding a 3rd mode (Draft Pick, not Blind Pick lol, been using the wrong term this whole time…thought something was off) you have the choice to play or not be a bad thing? (I know your response is going to be “it splits the player base”, Meltdown does that as well, should that be done away with?)

That will not change. The default Incursion would be unaffected. (Blind Pick)

Not true. Knowledge is power. Knowing your opponent’s abilities/passives will help in your tactics vs them. Having fun is one thing, would you rather win or lose? Win of course…For those players that want to have a competitive mode, why not?

Game: a form of play or sport, especially a competitive one played according to rules and decided by skill, strength, or luck. (first listing in the dictionary)

Absolutely untrue. Skill shots anyone? Footsies? (look it up…). As for the characters you listed I would say they need some more tuning (another topic for another time). Skill is most certainly a factor, but if it is the only factor, why even have character diversity since I can just choose anything and wreck anyone else.

Hard counter doesn’t necessarily translate to, I win since I picked him vs what you picked…lol, that’s asinine logic. Let’s head to hypothetical land; if both players have the same amount of skill level, who would win, the hard counter or the character being countered?

That may change in the future, what if they do release Incursion maps with multiple lanes? If they do, let’s hope it doesn’t take that amount of time to transition from each. Ever heard of lane swaps?

#39

Why is a mode like this necessary to go from casual to hardcore play? Because other hardcore games have it? Doesn’t mean this game couldn’t be seriouly competitive with only a blind pick option.

3 Likes
#40

What wyrde said. Also, please don’t shout.

#41

I’ve said it countless of times and i’ll say it again. I think people are too locked on comparing BB with others games - mainly pure FPS and pure MOBAs - and how they function not even considering that his is a hybrid of them and thus present a new set of challenges and how to do things.
People coming from playing FPS will want things to be how they’re used to be and the same applies for those who come from MOBA’s.
Just because game X does something in a certain way doesn’t really mean it has to translate into Battleborn.

#42

Some people seem to be stuck on the ideology that taking from other games should be shunned. This entire game is a mis-mash of other games/genres. As it should be, to make a good game you should pull good ideas from others, no?

Of course it can be competitive with a Blind Pick, but in a casual sort of way. Which would be more competitive; Blind Pick or Draft? (it’s rhetorical…)

I think you assume much. I have a vast knowledge of games, dabbling in most. Seeing as how I came from both the diverse backgrounds you listed, where do I stand? With the logic you’re employing you’re suggesting persons like myself would say; we need Deathmatch mode because CoD has it…

What you are saying is we can’t pick and choose good aspects from any genre since we’ll be treading too close the this dangerous behavior; “People coming from playing FPS will want things to be how they’re used to be and the same applies for those who come from MOBA’s.” Guess anyone with a differing opinion or idea should sit down and shutup eh?

This is what I don’t get about people…if something extra is to be added and doesn’t affect the base game. Why is it, there are persons adamant about not having it? It’s not like you’re being forced to utilize it…
Please answer me that (for the record I wasn’t shouting, some people have this condition where they don’t read the entire post and miss important information @Psychichazard)

#43

I’m not saying it should be shunned out of principal, but I also don’t think it should be brought in just because it’s a system you like in that other game.

That’s why I’m asking why Battleborn NEEDS the system to be competitive. There is a difference between “needs” and “wants”. Most arguements are revolving around guiding the competitive game to be more like the others with no specifics on why it can’t work competitively as is.

And while your question is rhetorical, I can see how both can be equally competitive.

#44

“Battleborn is: FPS; hobby-grade coop campaign; genre-blended, multi-mode competitive e-sports; meta-growth, choice + epic Battleborn Heroes!” - Randy Pitchford

How many e-sports MOBA use “Blind Pick”? (I know you’re a fan of rhetorical questions)
But, but, it’s not a MOBA…it’s not a MOBA as much as it is not a FPS (at least in regards to Incursion).

If this game is going to be e-sports, Blind Pick will not suffice.

1 Like
#45

Why? “Because everyone else does it” is not a sufficient explanation of why it wouldn’t work with just blind pick. I’m not saying that draft pick wouldn’t work in the game. It would. I’m saying I don’t see any evidence yet explaining why the absence of draft pick = no ranked competitive play.

#46

I think it would add another layer of depth to the game, not to mention variety. If you see the other team picking this certain character, maybe you go with a setup that you don’t normally use (as a team or individually) to counter that character. Seeing the other players could also determine what gear you might pick to bring in the match as well.

The draft pick system definitely does not have a place in public matches though, but for esports and competitive play it could work. Not sure it’s a deal breaker for BB competitive by any means though, just would add more depth.

#47

I see it less as adding a layer and more of shifting that layer of strategy from after picks to before picks.

#48

You still have to customize your helix and adjust your play style in game according to how the other team is playing, but at least you have a base to go off of with character selection and gear. Strictly in competitive play though.

#49

Not saying you wouldnt have strategy in match with draft pick, just saying choices you’d make after picks on a blind match you’d make before on draft.

Basically, I don’t see either mode, draft or blind, as having more or less strategy. It just happens at different times.

#50

Why not? I guess the way every self-respecting MOBA has been doing it is wrong? You know better than them I take it? I’m sure there was no deliberation on which mode would be used in e-sports and they just randomly chose Draft Pick, sounds legit.

Hard to be competitive when majority of Normals/Incursion (blind pick) [casuals for the most part] come in, autolock the champ they want to play and don’t use a mic. Now let’s say; if you were to get two pro teams and have them face-off, each match would likely be a mirror match. That sounds interesting to watch…lol That is until the next meta…etc.

For a team game blind pick is actually counterproductive, it’s still necessary as a training grounds of sorts. Powerful article and maybe make those opposed to having a Draft in the game listen to sense and reason: http://team-dignitas.net/articles/blogs/League-of-Legends/4249/A-look-into-Blind-Pick-and-Draft-Mode

Team Dignitas - they kind of know what they’re doing right?..

#51

Never said the other MOBAs were doing things wrong or that I know better. Just that they shouldn’t be the ONLY template for a successful competitive game. Esport game features should be looked at on a game by game basis instead of “all must have this”.

Articles makes some good points, but it is also referring specifically to LoL and I don’t feel all the same concerns/issues apply to Battleborn. There really aren’t any “hard counters” in the game and the synergy between a team is more important than anticipating your opposing teams strategy in the first 2 minutes during character selection. Everything in the article pointed more to faults with team play and communication, which would be a problem in either mode.

#52

agree to disagree I suppose

2 Likes
#53

Mark my words, this game will not last in the esports scene if blind pick for Incursion is the game mode of choice.

That’s where we’ll have to leave it. I don’t care for trying to change the mind of one contrarian. GBX should have all the information they need to make a decision whether to implement or not. I also tweeted Randy P., he will pass it onto his team if he feels it warranted, they can discuss further.

1 Like
#54

I’n not assuming anything i’m stating my personal opinion based on how pretty much all these threads end up being and what most players end up asking for and their reasons. It’s a matter of reading all the posts on these threads.
And it seems you’re misreading what i actually wrote …

It’s not a matter of picking good aspects from any genre - even though those are highly personal and subjective considering the polarity of opinions on this thread alone - it’s a matter of expecting them to be present just because another game has it.

The fact that you need to repeatably come up on how other games are using it just further proves my point. It’s not a problem of whether we, or rather GBX, should pick on another games but rather the fact that it does not have to do like “game x” does just because that’s how that particular genre does it.

I don’t know how you get that from what i wrote but please let’s be mature here and not distort what other people say ok ?

#55

Okay.

It’s getting a little too personal here. Stop talking about each other, and talk about games.

Politely.

#56

I was just about to say the same thing, let’s try and be mature and keep it on topic please.

#57

That was also directed to you. Check your pms. Thanks.