I was thinking about the ending and I still can’t fully grasp why the writers didn’t choose another way around.
So Calypsos was raised by their father on a god forsaken planet ,because he thinks that the leech is a too powerful to be let loose in the galaxy. Tyreen realized that at some point and escapes the planet with her brother to Pandora, which bring us to the events in the game.
Troy and Tyreen establish their cult by promising the bandits a Family (e.g. meaning or somewhere to belong), which is not a bad thing in a bandit head i guess. Also they stream their murders to show bandits how powerful they are by taking Lilith’s powers and later rendering Maya into dust. What’s going on in bandits heads:
-"Man, those two are really something. Maya and Lilith was kicking our asses all the time ,but these two actually defeated them. They are our saviors. "
Then we get to Eden-6 where Troy kinda started to rise against Tyreen. But the power struggle never happened. And then we get back to Pandora and they are together again. We kill Troy and then Typhon contact us. We get to Nekrotafeyo and find out that he is their father.
Why is he staying on Nekro most of the game,while he knows what they’re capable of? If he wanted to stop them he should been out looking for them. Or at least contacting us sooner. I think the impact of revealing their relation could have been more powerful if we already had Typhon with us. While he’s hiding his secret in hope for one last chance to save his children from themselves. His death would be quite more devastating since we get to know him earlier. I guess his logs had to do this job.
In the end we fight Tyreen merged with the Destroyer and she dies with it.
The message of these characters is kinda unclear. They start as arrogant pricks, overpowers us in the midgame and by the end we’re expected to feel sorry for them,but at the same time we have to kill them.
The end is where Borderlands 3 should have taken the turn and differentiate from 2. We may have to kill the Destroyer again,but Tyreen should survive without her powers.
A far greater punishment is not killing her but leaving her powerless to her followers,along with her great remorse. She promised the bandits a family, but she annihilated her own. If the power struggle with Troy happened and she kills him , then killing Typhon, the whole realization of what she did will crush her more than any bullet. Conscience can be a devastating thing once awakened in the heart of a merciless person. She may even beg us to kill her.
That’s how i would shed a tear for a girl that killed everyone who ever loved her because of her dreams of power.
I assume that the writers might thought of this being too cruel, but in my opinion that’s where the message of Tyreen is.
It’s just my opinion,you know. I wont criticize anyone who likes the current ending, but i personally expected a slightly different spin this time.
The calypos’s were terribly handled/wriitten. They don’t even annoy me. They just had alot of potential and basically the developers chose the most boring and least interesting alternative at EVERY turn. Tyreen treats her brother like ■■■■ at every turn, so a good turn would have been her showing actual remorse at his death. But nope. Troy never got the uprising that was hinted at throughout.
Tyreen wanted to absorb the Destroyer for no reason imo. She knows what the thing is, and still thinks that’s the best way to get ultimate power? Why not just absorb all of the sirens and get ultimate power that way?
The set ups are there and i believe the writers had this in mind, but they abandoned it for some reason.
I don’t think Tyreen has a conscience. If left powerless, her only remorse would be her own lack of power. It’s clear from the start that her idea of “family” is people whose only purpose is to serve her whims. She has one of her adopted “family” cut off his own legs and then devours him remarking that they taste better when they’re afraid. Sometimes a psychopath is just a psychopath.
Jack was also a psychopath and displayed more emotion. I think the issue with tyreen is that outside of her base personality, she don’t have much going for her.She doesn’t have a “thing”. If streaming was supposed to be her thing it was poorly executed.
That’s the trick, making you believe she had no conscience ,but in the end she did. People always think that worst things happens only to others, but when it happens to them it will trigger a reaction they don’t even know that it’s been there the whole time. Ripping her off her powers will reveal her insecurity and with that will come the realization of everything she did.
Storywise I’m just following the logic of her “daddy issues” and why it was shown to us. Her origin story makes her more than a regular psycho, but the whole thing didn’t go anywhere with her being just murdered.
Exactly. The set up/potential was there and Gearbox just went with the blandest option they could. It makes me wonder if previous drafts had a better story and take two decided otherwise
Actually, the story makes sure to show you she has not an iota of conscience via her “daddy issues” when she kills Typhon and… nothing. Remorse is for mortals.
I think you are writing for the writers rather than seeing what’s there… imo
Then I have to assume you either haven’t beaten the game or else utterly ignored that cutscene.
Ah. Why does everyone who defends the game’s universally panned story and writing get snappy?
I think you are filling in the blanks the writers didn’t bother too. It’s head-canon, not real canon.
If it fits you that’s ok. But I think it’s not even close to this:
It looks like they tried something, but they threw it away. I don’t know why. The opportunities were there. But you know what, it’s their game. They’re free to do whatever they want. And I’m free to have my opinion,right?
That wasn’t snappy. What I gave was an apt description of the scene - she kills her father and has no emotional reaction to it. If you think I’m making that up, then the charitable assumption is that you didn’t see it or else ignored it.
And if the writing is universally panned, then there perforce wouldn’t be anyone defending it.
Also, the very premise of this thread is speculation about those very blanks. If I were going to actually fill in those blanks, then rather than merely describing the moment as it actually happened I would add that not only did Tyreen not show emotion after killing her father, but for a moment she expected to and just shrugged and moved on when she didn’t.
Going further down that rabbit hole, earlier in the game Tyreen quips “that’s just something people say - I don’t really believe it” and that sums up her character. She doesn’t have the same connections as other people. And when she tries to ape them, as with her “family”, they’re but twisted echoes. That is her “thing”. It makes her a bit unrelatable, but some villains are only monsters.
No. I disagree.
You are assuming that she shows no emotion for killing her father because of her belief that she’s a god in the making. But the scene does not state that is the reason she has no emotion. It is NEVER STATED why she has no emotion. Also to note, she didn’t kill her father. she just prevented his double suicide.
The writing is panned. I used universally for affect. Not to be taking literally. But hey, if you taking it literally helps you straw man opposing viewpoints. go right ahead.
Don’t quite know what you are communicating in your 4th paragraph. Not trying to be disrespectful
The quip tyreen says, didn’t come across as a deep look into her psyche to me. And if it was meant to be one, I don’t think it’s meaning would be that she lacks human connections. I don’t think she tries to mimic human’s at all. And if that is meant to be a character trait “her inability to mimic humans”. it’s inconsistent across her writing. or at the very least not consistently shown. Again, I think you are assuming.
this one goes in the poor writing department. Honesty up till the part where you go to Nekrotafeya and really get involved with Typhon the story is ok, not great but ok, as soon as he is involved it’s cringe worthy.
Tyreen leeched her mother,right? And as you assumed that Tyreen is born a monster, then why she didn’t leech Typhon too, before the escape? He is the reason for them being “imprisoned”. Kill the small guy that keeps you in,then go conquer the universe. That didn’t happen. Instead he was brought in later for shock value, to predispose that Tyreen still have some affection after all. Also why she didn’t let her brother die if she doesn’t care about anything? Even being an ■■■■■■■ the entire time she does care about Troy and Typhon.
She was using her brother. To help her get off the planet. To spread the holy word. To open the great vault. Even at his end she used him to recover.
I suspect there are two reasons she didn’t face off with her father before leaving the first time: a measure of fear, and because she had something to prove.
You realize that we wont have this conversation if any of these were well explained in the game, right?
Tyreen annoyance when she had to share with Troy is there,but she did it anyway. If you think that Tyreen is the ultimate monster, then she doesn’t need any of them to reach her goal. Them being in the game only to justify how cruel she is, is pointless because we already know that. Troy and Typhon deaths should have been used to crush her after the final fight, otherwise they’re not much different than any of her followers, killed by her. They’re just wasted potential and people notice that.
I just want to say how sad I am that Telltale games are no more. Can you imagine a looter, shooter, 4 vault hunter game where each one of your characters not only have the skill trees, online multiplayer, and all the gaming elements of bl3 coupled with the awesome multi paved interactive story play of Telltale?! Man, the different paths and story lines that could create. Imagine if it was by your choices that the Calypsos turned out the way they did. Or maybe, through your actions Tyreen doesn’t kill her father. Maybe in your game lilith never looses her powers, or Maya doesn’t die. Or maybe things are a heck of a lot worse. Not to mention you could actually get a more three dementional look at your own character. Instead of you’re “generic vh1,2,3, or 4” you’re an actual important part of the story. You know, that’d be a pretty amazing dlc actually. Not the events that have already happened. But, maybe a short “in the after math” type of story. Imo, of course.
Tell that to the guy who lets all of your wild speculation slide because he agrees with it, but jumps down my throat for creating “head canon” if I present the barest of embellishments to accompany an in-game fact.
Tyreen is ultimately a monster, but I wouldn’t say she’s the ultimate monster. Without Troy, it seems she wouldn’t have gotten off Nekrotafeyo. She needed him to get a ship working (based on an Echo). Together, with some trial and error, they built their cult of personality and began exploiting the bandits (also based on an Echo). Troy kept proving himself useful to her goal, so she kept him around. It’s possible she did have more of a connection to him than anyone, but that doesn’t get explored any more than how far his resentment of her goes. In the end, however, her (arguably intentionally shallow) character is built on the theme of using people, and she remained true to that - leeching the defeated Troy to restore herself and continue with her plan.
There’s always unexplored potential in a story. Any story, “good” or “bad”, that has fans will see those fans theorizing and arguing about such things. I think the character of Troy and Tyreen was explored as much as necessary. But I would’ve liked more. And I personally think it would have been more interesting if you could lose the fight with Troy and he ends up killing his sister and going on to become the last boss. (In this head canon, the Troy ending would become the accepted story ending and the next playable siren would be a boy with leech-oriented powers.)
However, as mentioned, I think their story was explored enough. If there’s “wasted” potential, I’d say it’s in the development and exploration of various protagonists and their relationships. It seems to me like that was intended to be more the case this go round, but things got cut for time or something.