Will the champ rise again?

Do you guy think ED is going to get a few buffs on the next update? Maybe a rework?

What would you guys like to see him get? Do you think he could be viable in a competitive setting? And finally, what do you think he needs to be stronger in Incursion?

Apparently I can’t post this post with only the quote, so I’ll just throw in this otherwise unnecessary sentence to make me able to post this :no_mouth:

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I believe Randy made a post somewhere on here saying he was getting a small buff to his survivability which will help him on Incursion immensely as he’s already very tanky late game. [quote=“lucasatlive, post:1, topic:1561730”]
Do you think he could be viable in a competitive setting?
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He’s already very good in a competitive setting as he’s performed very well in the PC league with me having a perfect win record when using him. He just needs a small buff on incursion as he’s usable in his current state just not better than some of the other picks like Rath or Shayne.

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I would like to see him get an overshield somehow. I don’t know if that would make him op or not. Maybe change one of his level 1 helixes to give him an overshield on dragon splash.

If boulder and shayne can get one, I don’t see why not

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I think his early game survivabilty only needs a buff. I would love to see his level 9 lifesteal moved a bit lower down, that could be enough?

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That’s probably his 2-3rd best helix and it should remain where it’s at as it allows him to 1v2 fairly well. It’s honestly a broken helix and the lifesteal should be reduced because right now he can get 400-600 health per person he hits with clothesline + knockup and gets a full heal on a wave. Stacking health on him means he can soak something like 6000 damage if he heals when low which is insane.

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Dragon is probably 1 of just a very select few who has a Helix where every level grants him something significant to his play-style. I think everything is where it needs to be. The only issue his helices have is that some are clearly better than others making some just the “no-brainer” choice. It’s honestly a matter of fiddling with numbers to bring a little bit more variety (either nerfing some helixes to bring them in par with the other, or buffing the others).

Otherwise, his Shield Buff a few months ago was a step in the right direction. I’d be fine with either another small health/shield buff (100-200 points, nothing serious) OR his Stacks also granting a bit of health/shield and/or damage reduction/Heath Regen.

I really do miss playing El Dragon, haven’t played him in almost a year.

Sure, he’s tanky late game (but only with a specific build and loadout), but if he can’t soak up enough damage early and mid-game, how could he keep up? Buildables don’t reward as much XP as they did, and Thralls are a mixed bag when it comes to squishy characters taking them. If Dragon gets focused or stunned once in lane, he’s done for. And it doesn’t take long to focus him down, maybe around five seconds at best. If Dragon gets killed a lot in lane, he falls behind.

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The only issues he should be having are very early game where you are only diving and killing the Shepard if possible before Clothes-lining out. Once you hit 3 the clap helps you immensely with safe wave clear and upon hitting 4 you’re officially online and can begin picking up kills. He’s an absolute power house late game that can tank 2-3 people depending if you hit level 9 or not yet.

If you haven’t already i recommend you watch some of the PC league VODs on twitch and see for yourself how good he is in comp play. Here’s the link. Any meltdown or capture match with Red Bars 4 Life I should be playing him.

Capture and Meltdown El Dragon I can see performing well, it’s the Incursion Dragon I’m worried about.

Late-game Dragon is pretty neato, but I think you’re simplifying it. Early game Dragon will have issues yeah, even like with the Shepard diving and whatnot. The clap has okay waveclear I guess, but that takes longer than regular melee combos, though it’s safer and unsafe compared to the regular combo because a. you won’t be in the middle of a wave, so you can run easily if you need to b. you are exposed for longer to the enemy, unless you’re behind a piece of cover

I think the problem we’re all forgetting is CC and squishiness. Even with max health gear, El Dragon’s wide frame (and to an extent, how some of the community sees him as a walking sack of xp, misinformed or not) makes him a prime target for cc and focus fire. The other assassin-harasser-yadadadas have the capability to launch CC from a safe range as well – think of Rath with Smash or Caldarius with Flashbang. Dragon has the Clothesline knockup, but that requires getting close and personal, and it only comes at level 4. Dragon’s overall in-your-face playstyle makes him very risky to play, as he is susceptible to stuns, slows, knockups, heavy AoE damage, sentry fire if a push is being made, and multiple other dangers on the battlefield. The other melee characters can deal with this all throughout the game in ways other than just running away, and i’m talking about level three here:

Rath: Taking fire? Catalyctic Smash, or use lifesteal to recover health, or crossblade slow so they can’t chase you.

Deande: Cloak or airkick to flee.

Attikus: Pounce, but only if you didn’t use it to initiate. It has a long cooldown, but I see most Attiki use Pounce to escape anyways.

Kelvin: Sublimate.

Boldur: Chuck the axe and boldurdash away.

Gali: Walk backwards with your shield raised.

Phoebe: Phasegate, same deal as with Attikus though.

Dragon has Clothesline, but that has a longer cooldown. And again, his wide frame and low health makes him an easy target. If he gets hit a lot earlier in the game, he’ll have trouble catching up later.

Every character has power spikes at different levels and come online at different levels with Dragons only being level 4. Rath is online at level 1 as you mentioned because Catsmash is a safe CC poke and Crossblade does decent damage and is also ranged but his late game compared to Dragons is very lacking. You need to build a team around what characters you can get in draft and Dragon certainly is not a first pick but is still a very solid pick.

On Incursion if the enemy team has multiple silences and hard CC no Dragon is a terrible pick because his kit revolves around turning his initiation into picks since he has no ult but his bulk allows him to stay in longer then most characters. In that situation Having a silence like Rath and someone to follow-up like Kelvin to stun 2-5 people is a much better pick. If the other team decided to go with a more ranged heavy camp comp Dragon is a fine pick to disrupt and make plays with.

Remember this is comp play so most of the OP CC heavy characters will be banned because neither team likes dealing with so it frees up for some interesting team comps.

Meltdown/Capture/Faceoff are all great modes for him with incursion being the only mode he’s kinda in limbo since he’s a dive character. He’s not terrible as iv’e consistently gotten good numbers with him but there are certainly much better choices especially with no draft.

In comp play Dragon should get dominated by either Shayne or Montana.

Outside of comp, the CC tanks are available and he gets destroyed by them!

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It’s even worse for new players. I’m sure they feel like they’re playing cod sometimes given how fast he can die. You shouldnt have to be a god at the game to make a character viable.
He’s a character where the slightest mistake can cost you dearly. Even if that mistake is just something like deciding show up in a lane

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Can’t get that link to work. Maybe it’s cause I’m on mobile

Well, this is where our discussion stops. You’re talking strictly about competitive play whereas I generally meant Dragon in pubs and in Incursion. And not every hard CC character is OP…

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Montana yes, Shayne no… She lacks the damage to kill him once he hits 5 and has his gear online and unless she has 2 other people hard focusing him with her she’s not going to do much to him.

If you want i can pull up all of my pub match history and shoot you a DM so you can see how he fairs with randoms.

  1. Do you play primarily on PC or Xbox?

  2. You are a god at El Dragon, so I’m not sure this would help your average joe-schmuck like me.

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Considering you cannot even get a public game on PC anymore I’m going to say xbox and ps4 for pubs. :stuck_out_tongue: I do primarily play private 10 mans on PC though.

It gives you a goal to work towards I guess?

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Oh, you’re on PS4? Had no idea.

Also, meh, not sure I can hit that level. In the meantime I will practice ascending to godhood of solo-tanking in Battlefield One.